# Working toward food self sufficiency
**URL:** http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226
**Category:** Homesteading
**Created:** [March 24, 2023, 10:03am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226 "2023-03-24T10:03:19Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 6
### Author:  [@JohanM](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/JohanM)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2023, 11:25am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/101 "2023-04-10T11:25:34Z")
I guess this could be applied to any species that have a milkstomach, there are not that many that keeps goats round here but sheep is more common so I have to talk to a friend that is a sheepfarmer.
It is good to see the pictures to know how it should look just in case something goes horribly wrong with it.
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### Author:  [@KristijanL](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/KristijanL)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2023, 11:44am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/102 "2023-04-10T11:44:52Z")
I have heard they are made from calfs usualy, but for a small scale operation its probably better to sacrifice a baby goat or sheep thain a calf…
But one shuld connect with larger goat/sheep farmers. There are always mortalitys in the flock, l have seen goats hang them self etc… if done quick probably the stomack shuld still be useable?
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### Author:  [@Norman89](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/Norman89)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2023, 3:54pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/103 "2023-04-10T15:54:49Z")
I jave seen that as well, they get rambunctious and in a spot. Cows Deer and elk get caught in fences to. Used to have a friend cow farmer that would call dad when this happened and we got to salvage the animal in trade for fixing the fences. Was maybe once every 2 years it happened when coyotes got the herd running crazy. I have also found a dead elk that got his antlers tangled in construction fencing during the rut. They just tear stuff up in aggression sometimes
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2023, 6:54pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/104 "2023-04-10T18:54:04Z")
> [@KristijanL](#):
>
> To me, deep mulch was the revelation. Its a lot of work too, collecting leaves and all that… but all the work can be done in colder months, where there is less of other stuff to do.
You can do it that way, but you have to be careful so it doesn’t mat up and create anaerobic conditions or else you defeat the purpose. nor do you want to disturb the microbial ecosystem underneath the leaves with tillage. I quit using the deep mulch because mine is mostly grass clippings and those mat up, and drink water. I pile it, I stab it with a pitchfork and add lime and water then spread it around for weed suppression so it is only a few inches. and I am pretty liberal about kicking it around once it is spread out. 🙂
I have mainly dead soil in especially “the lawn” where you can’t compost so making the compost tea, and using a sprayer is actually pretty easy and fast.
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2023, 7:12pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/105 "2023-04-10T19:12:13Z")
> [@madflower69](#):
>
> Two days is probably good for the fungal replication. I was curious about how full I could fill the bucket without it overflowing and not making a mess
I will correct myself, I don’t see anywhere where the mycorrhizal fungi are replicating in a solution, only cultures… And carbs like molasses and rock phosphate are beneficial to help them grow. Similar to:
> **[How to make your own mycorrhizal fungi](https://www.natureworks.org.uk/blog/make-your-own-mychorrizal-inoculum/)**
>
> You can make your own arbuscular mycorrhizal fungi inoculant, like rootgrow™, for adding to roots for healthier plants. Notes & photos kindly from Antony & Emma of @HyphaeShroomery. Photos copyright @HyphaeShroomery.
Maybe in that JADAM recipe use wood ash instead of sea salt since that will contain phosphorous, potassium and calcium and other micronutrients then adjust the pH.
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [April 10, 2023, 8:49pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/106 "2023-04-10T20:49:10Z")
Oh.. I think I found what I was looking for. He adds the fungus, and azospirillium (which is nitrogen fixing bacteria) and a bunch of other things. someone posted it was 345 dollars for the ingredients but this most likely makes several batches. But for liquid gold in the plant world this might be as close as it gets. I have to write out the ingredient list to see if there is a place to skimp or whether that is accurate. It doesn’t look like it replicates the mycorrhizal fungus, but the presoaking helps the germination rate)
[ ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gLC8WeW7Uvo)
The ingredients:
55 gallon drum
400 micron compost tea bag (pool filter mesh)
bubbling aerator
5-15lbs of “good” compost (variety of sources works better)
different brew times give different results but 2 days.
4oz of soluable kelp
4oz of fish emulsion or fish hydrolysate
8 tablespoons of mycorrhizal water soluble fungus inoculant
(Xtreme Gardening HGC721220 Mykos WP (Wettable Powder Hydroponic Root Enhancer))
—(end of elaine inghams formula)—
2Tablespoons
(Xtreme Gardening Azos beneficial bacteria for rootings and transplants)
4tablespoons of EM super cera C (agriculture) ceramic powder.
2 tablespoons Real Growers Recharge - Soil Microbe Superpack - Natural Plant Growth Stimulant
1 tablespoon of Mikro-Myco, Highly Concentrated Mycorrhizal Fungi
(the more I look at the replication in the recipe, either he is hoping for different strains between brands, or it is a tax write off for his pot hydroponic system, or he is trying to do product placement. ) although I think the Azos is a worthwhile add.
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### Author:  [@FruitvaleFarmer](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/FruitvaleFarmer)
#### Post date: [April 11, 2023, 2:05am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/107 "2023-04-11T02:05:34Z")
Here’s an organization that deals with self-sufficiency generally, but has some simple, and I think, useful ideas for food production.
Home Page: [Home2](http://www.abundaculture.org/home2)
Training Manual: [http://www.abundaculture.org/atm/assets/abundaculturemanual.pdf](http://www.abundaculture.org/atm/assets/abundaculturemanual.pdf)
Simple, basic, not flashy, but a good place to start.
Kent
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [April 12, 2023, 9:25pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/108 "2023-04-12T21:25:42Z")
> [@tcholton717](#):
>
> When you are aireating the tea will get a little frothy on the surface.
In the lab, they use yeast extract, which is yeast with the cells walls that have dissolved to grow bacteria. so that could be right for bacteria. (or fungus I will double check that. )
A pinch of salt is used for fungi to help prevent microbial growth in the lab.. I am not sure how that all works when you are trying to grow bacteria and fungus in the same bin. But as near as I can tell, you aren’t replicating the fungus in the pot, you are basically washing the ‘spores’ from the compost and pre germinating them which takes like 2 days.
I was trying to look up how to replicate the Azospirilla since that is like 3-4 dollars an ounce, and I don’t MIND spending some money, but when you want to scale this out to acres, it quickly starts to hit the cost prohibitive mark… It replicates fast in the right conditions so an ounce could yield a lot more. The media is called Nfb whch is a nitrogen free semi-solid media. This is how some folks do it.
> **[18BBO5EL-U2.pdf](https://gacbe.ac.in/pdf/ematerial/18BBO5EL-U2.pdf)**
>
> 190.02 KB
This is some more recipes for the solid and semi-solid:
[baldani2014.pdf](http://forum.driveonwood.com/uploads/short-url/6Ob0UDTeGlTnmFxmcgPUopy8Qhx.pdf) (2.5 MB)
The sterilization part is typically 15lbs of pressure in an autoclave, which pressure canners can get to those levels. According to the folks on the mushroom growers, some have good luck with increased times in instant pots which only get to like 10psi which is the european standard.
As far as the webinar, it was a very basic overview and very little information. It was an overview that took an hour that was condensed to about 15min thanks to fast forward. 🙂 What I did learn is they are very afraid of removing the diversity of the local species by cloning and doing mass distribution of lab species.
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### Author:  [@tcholton717](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/tcholton717)
#### Post date: [June 5, 2023, 9:17pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/109 "2023-06-05T21:17:53Z")
A badly made video about how I plant my tomatoes.
[ ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXwVGxlnF5E)
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### Author:  [@KristijanL](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/KristijanL)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 6:14am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/110 "2023-06-06T06:14:04Z")
Good trick there with the paintcan! I just put the last tomatos in too, will try mext year.
What do you use as support? Stakes?
Got any blight problems up there near the swamp?
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### Author:  [@Jan](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/Jan)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 7:30am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/111 "2023-06-06T07:30:11Z")
I’m surprised you can grow tomatoes and peppers outside, wonder if it works here too, we had frost 3-4 days ago. the potatoes that had just arrived were burnt.
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### Author:  [@tcholton717](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/tcholton717)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 10:11am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/112 "2023-06-06T10:11:01Z")
I do what’s called a Florida weave for the determinates, Kristijan. just a stake or T-post between every other plant and then a horizon line of twine in and out of them as they grow to keep them upright. Have never had any problems with blight on tomatoes or potatoes. Slugs are the main thing that bothers the fruit but with the paint can collars I can lay a band of wood ash outside them and that deters the slugs. That and the two big garter snakes that have chosen to patrol the garden.
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### Author:  [@tcholton717](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/tcholton717)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 10:21am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/113 "2023-06-06T10:21:29Z")
Tomatoes and peppers have to be started inside here Jan. Usually in early March. I start them in cells and them make one transfer into some kind of disposable cup so most of the plants are a good size when they get planted out. Our last frost is supposed to be the end of May, which it was, and our fall frost is middle of September. That’s a little iffy but we have had years when it didn’t come until middle of October. It may have been you that mentioned about the corn. You can grow it in colder climates, but probably not in big quantities. Start the seeds in paper cups with the bottoms cut out of them. Stand them up in totes and when they get about a foot tall plant them cup and all.
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### Author:  [@Woodrunner](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/Woodrunner)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 10:46am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/114 "2023-06-06T10:46:23Z")
Just a tip from me, these are effective against slug’s and snails, they also “airs” the soil some.
One drawback is that tiny seedlings tend to get eaten to 🙄
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### Author:  [@Jan](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/Jan)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 11:28am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/115 "2023-06-06T11:28:49Z")
We do the same with the tomatoes, starting at the end of February, but now have them in a small greenhouse that I made.
Tried doing as you say with the corn, but it probably also got hit by the frost, but I don’t have any problems with water, the lake is quite close.
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### Author:  [@don\_mannes](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/don_mannes)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 1:55pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/116 "2023-06-06T13:55:54Z")
My little garden this year.
Near side:
Tomatoes, green and yellow pole beans, peppers, sweetcorn, zuchinni and red potatoes.
far side:
Peas, onions, green and yellow bush beans.
Grass clipping mulch keeps most weeds down.
5 more rows of sweet corn in 2 stage plantings. (hope I can harvest them before the coons this year)
4 - 60 ft. rows of white and red potatoes (seed from last years crop. No fence because Bugs Bunny won’t eat them!
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### Author:  [@SteveUnruh](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/SteveUnruh)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 2:01pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/117 "2023-06-06T14:01:46Z")
Hey TomH.
You video look just fine. Inspiring. Real good to hear your voice too.
Lot of evolved tricks and techniques you show. I KNEW there was a reason I’d been saving back all of those 32-37 ounce coffee cans.
The past few years for our garden ground working I’ve been pulling the bits out of Korean and Japanese squat work gardening tools and inserting them into long wooden rake handles.
I gave up trying to buy a long handled flat time forked spading tool and I knocked the head out of an old short D-handled one and long handled it too.
Much, much better on the old back, knees and hips.
Just saying. It helps a lot.
Now we are investing in 32 inch tall raised beds. Not cheap at all. Ha! About the costs for a 2-3kW PV solar array that I just never seem to see the $$$$'s to get.
Regards
Steve Unruh
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 2:17pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/118 "2023-06-06T14:17:52Z")
> [@Woodrunner](#):
>
> Just a tip from me, these are effective against slug’s and snails, they also “airs” the soil some.
I have always had good luck killling snails and slugs with string trimmers too. although I use the plastic blades so not only does it wipe out small plants but plants up to about 1cm in diameter. 🤣
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### Author:  [@Woodrunner](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/Woodrunner)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 2:24pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/119 "2023-06-06T14:24:57Z")
Yes, those trimmers fix the slug’s, only a little messy 🤢
We sometimes get invaded by the big brown “murder slugs” eating all in their way, have to walk the garden border, puting salt on them slimy b\*\*tards, the ones invading the garden the duck takes care of.
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [June 6, 2023, 2:29pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/working-toward-food-self-sufficiency/7226/120 "2023-06-06T14:29:18Z")
> [@Jan](#):
>
> I’m surprised you can grow tomatoes and peppers outside, wonder if it works here too, we had frost 3-4 days ago. the potatoes that had just arrived were burnt.
You should be able to. You probably have to protect them from frost.(it is the sun hitting the ice crystals (which are like magnifying glasses) on the leaves that causes the burn) Usually a plastic sheet over the top is good enough. Although you can just sprinkle water on them before the sun comes up. They grow them inside in Sweden because the indeterminate types will produce fruit until they are killed by the cold. In a hothouse that could be years. If I remember correctly Sweden produces most of the fresh tomatoes in the European market mainly because of the off-season production in hothouses.
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