# Off Grid Batteries
**URL:** http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378
**Category:** Homesteading
**Tags:** off-grid
**Created:** [March 19, 2016, 1:30pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378 "2016-03-19T13:30:09Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 24
### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [January 29, 2023, 12:38am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/462 "2023-01-29T00:38:51Z")
> [@trikebuilder57](#):
>
> It would be nice if there were easy plans to build batteries from easy to get materials.
That is why i posted those links. đ The brass iron one looks like it is the best, and it isnât that hard. not super dense but if you are sitting on a bunch of brass and steel for scrap to sellâŚ
The first part is the clean up to get the grease and oxidation off, then you just use electrolysis on it.
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### Author:  [@ForbiddenTuna](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/ForbiddenTuna)
#### Post date: [January 29, 2023, 1:26am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/463 "2023-01-29T01:26:14Z")
Apparently the brass and iron batteries work best with iron oxide if you use a chlorine solution. Not sure if that means you can just rust up an iron plate or if youâd need to compress some oxide together.
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### Author:  [@trikebuilder57](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/trikebuilder57)
#### Post date: [January 29, 2023, 9:55pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/464 "2023-01-29T21:55:26Z")
What I mean is , spare me all the chemical mumbo jumbo ,and tell me how to build a real life usable storage battery from redally available stuff.
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### Author:  [@tcholton717](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/tcholton717)
#### Post date: [January 29, 2023, 11:46pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/465 "2023-01-29T23:46:53Z")
Edison batteries are the only things that come to mind Al.
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### Author:  [@KKubu](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/KKubu)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2023, 5:37am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/466 "2023-01-30T05:37:37Z")
I would kindly disagree, because construction of useful Edison battery is beyond DIY area. I think that the good old copper-zinc [Daniell cell - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Daniell_cell) is quite more practical for someone who want to make something ourself
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2023, 8:28am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/467 "2023-01-30T08:28:35Z")
The Edison Cell is only beyond the DIY arena because of making the Nickle. Otherwise the cell is fairly simple, and you can construct it.
The Daniell Cell from my understanding isnât reversible, you canât charge it.
The Brass/iron battery is based on the so called baghdad battery. It has a really low density, but brass and iron both weigh a lot. I didnât look for âefficiencyâ or if it off gassed, or anything like that. It was on the show mythbusters, and they actually electroplated something with their replica.
There is no archeological evidence to support it being a battery or they did electroplating but could you imagine being in like 280 bc with a pile of lead, making like roman coins and then electroplating gold on it? You would be rich or dead pretty quick. đ
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### Author:  [@KKubu](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/KKubu)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2023, 9:11am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/468 "2023-01-30T09:11:56Z")
Since the chemistry od Daniellâs cell is reversible, so the cell should be rechargeable. It is mentioned in Wikipedia. It might be that charging current must be kept low, which may discourage practical use. But the construction is simple and from common materials readily available on the market or scrapyard.
There is no off gas, no electrode or electrolyte degradation, easy repair, âŚ
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### Author:  [@ForbiddenTuna](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/ForbiddenTuna)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2023, 11:31am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/469 "2023-01-30T11:31:56Z")
The Baghdad battery used copper, not brass. It also used an acidic electrolyte and not a basic one.
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### Author:  [@KKubu](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/KKubu)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2023, 12:18pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/470 "2023-01-30T12:18:53Z")
After some research, I have to recall some of my statements.
Daniellâs cell is not rechargeable in its basic costruction with ceramic permeable separator. It is also prone to spontaneous discharge by migrating Cu cations through separator. It might diminished by stable power drawing which coplicates overall design even more. But still, with some invention, viable design could be find and then the availability and price of material would win
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2023, 6:53pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/471 "2023-01-30T18:53:12Z")
> [@ForbiddenTuna](#):
>
> The Baghdad battery used copper, not brass. It also used an acidic electrolyte and not a basic one
You are right. I will stand corrected. đ
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### Author:  [@ForbiddenTuna](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/ForbiddenTuna)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2023, 7:08pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/472 "2023-01-30T19:08:13Z")
I would like to experiment with brass iron base electrolyte though.
Maybe compare it to copper iron acid. I wouldnât even know where to begin on telling how many volts per cell, but I do have a capacity discharge tester.
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### Author:  [@madflower69](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/madflower69)
#### Post date: [January 30, 2023, 10:20pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/473 "2023-01-30T22:20:54Z")
> [@ForbiddenTuna](#):
>
> Maybe compare it to copper iron acid. I wouldnât even know where to begin on telling how many volts per cell, but I do have a capacity discharge tester.
You just read volts with a multimeter. The youtube guy in the 3rd link is great because he isnât using âproper scientific methodâ and doing everything all perfect. And he goes through a BUNCH of different chemistries.
The Brass/iron battery actually reacts with the copper in the brass. I donât know why they didnât just use straight up copper. I donât know if the zinc helps or not, they donât appear to mention it. And I am looking for someone that replicated it. And -this- may be why we donât see much, but notice in the patent, zinc can be used as the electrolyte, so brass might work better.
> **[CN101593844A - High-iron-copper accumulator
- Google Patents](https://patents.google.com/patent/CN101593844A/en)**
>
> The invention mainly relates to a high-iron-copper storage battery which comprises a positive electrode, a negative electrode, electrolyte and a diaphragm positioned between the positive electrode and the negative electrode. The storage battery...
The Iron battery has a really low voltage but they do have really good directions on how to build it in their supplemental material.
\*\*on second look the patent appears to be withdrawn in 2012.
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### Author:  [@DanNH](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/DanNH)
#### Post date: [January 31, 2023, 6:15pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/474 "2023-01-31T18:15:04Z")
Tom i have watched many of Robert Murray Smithâs videos on batteries. I was left with the impression that the cost wouldnât be any better than mass production batteries when all was said and done. The zink Bromine cells looked the most viable to me but i was looking at an EV tractor application and he hid the trick to make them a gel cell behind his paywall. I wasnât going to subscribe for one video.
Also the Bromine is pretty nasty stuff in high concentrations. In the end i decided the purchased batteries where the best bet. Not that i have made it that far with my small ev tractor project it gets put on the back burner for other projects all the time.
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### Author:  [@tcholton717](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/tcholton717)
#### Post date: [January 31, 2023, 10:00pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/475 "2023-01-31T22:00:00Z")
I didnât even know he had a pay for more information option Dan. I thought he just skimmed the surface of different subjects and still had the time to put out endless videoâs. I have to be in the mood to watch them anyway. His voice and presentation is like nails on the blackboard for me at times.
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### Author:  [@DanNH](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/DanNH)
#### Post date: [January 31, 2023, 10:17pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/476 "2023-01-31T22:17:00Z")
I think they are members only videos on his YouTube channel but i would try to contact him before i tried to get that information IIRC he has atleast 2 YouTube channels now.
It has probably been over a year since i watched much of his channel. When he got off batteries and i decided the cost saving where not there for me i stopped watching.
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### Author:  [@ForbiddenTuna](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/ForbiddenTuna)
#### Post date: [February 2, 2023, 12:58pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/477 "2023-02-02T12:58:57Z")
[ ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=li7IVNYXEes)
This guy is showing his own testing if DIY batteries. Most promising is copper positive and steel negative. He wrapped the steel plates with steel wool in a potash electrolyte and it really helped. The first test is that cell, others are the second style he built.
His next test is going to be copper and steel BBs suspended in plastic baskets. That will be very interesting to see.
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### Author:  [@DanNH](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/DanNH)
#### Post date: [February 4, 2023, 3:32pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/478 "2023-02-04T15:32:45Z")
> **[EVE LF280K Grade A Cells - 3.2V LiFePO4 280Ah Battery](https://www.18650batterystore.com/products/eve-lf280k)**
>
> Offered per cell BRAND NEW, GRADE A EVE LF280K CELLS Matching Voltage, Capacity, Internal Resistance bus-bars & 4 nuts and bolts Included (Nickel Plated Copper) 10+ years design life, 6,000 cycles! FULL EXCEL REPORT AVAILABLE BY REQUEST...
That is a pretty good price for anyone in the USA.
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### Author:  [@KKubu](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/KKubu)
#### Post date: [February 8, 2023, 4:52am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/479 "2023-02-08T04:52:45Z")
With such a price, who would invest effort into DIY battery of comparable service.
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### Author:  [@tcholton717](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/tcholton717)
#### Post date: [February 8, 2023, 11:59am UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/480 "2023-02-08T11:59:23Z")
Itâs like hiring someone to get your wife pregnant Kamil. Somethings you just want to DIY.
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### Author:  [@KKubu](http://forum.driveonwood.com/u/KKubu)
#### Post date: [February 8, 2023, 3:07pm UTC](http://forum.driveonwood.com/t/off-grid-batteries/2378/481 "2023-02-08T15:07:46Z")
OK, Tom, family affairs aside đ. If I would commit myself to DIY equipment like battery, I would choose the solution which is exhaustively documented, easily constructable with basic tools from cheap abundant materials, preferably obtainable also as DIY. For this sake I would abstain little bit from excellent performance and parameters. All these things direct me to the classical lead-acid battery in deep cycle construction.
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