I am a techno-neanderthal and wouldn’t have the first clue how to set up a site. I know that Vimeo censored content questioning the plandemic. I view content on Rumble and Brighteon but they seem a little hard to navigate. I like Telegram.
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Hey guys.
Think back how many have come onto the DOW and later commented how peaceful and respectful it is.
This is in comparison to other internet forum experieces that they have had.
For years I subscribed to the BackwoodsHome magazine. Bought their books.
Well . . . in their transition from the founder Dave Duffy and his close selected pals to his newer younger generation kids they set up an online forum too. Were trying to gravitate to no-more-bimonthly paper publications. The forum quickly turned into a mess. I’d joined. I followed looking for any woodgas users. None. Thought about activating some topic lines. Reading more the activity there, it was just too much a free-for-all, wild-wild hot mess.
They had to shut it down and backtrack to on-paper publications. Huh. I guess I should resubscribe. Busy, busy, busy. I keep forgetting.
The success of the current DOW is much to do with what it does not have. What it does not allow.
Debates turned to soapboxing, flamings, cage-matches.
Even so here, have had to set some current topics into a no-no we just do not want to talk about that here.
COVID. Vacinations. The Ukraine war.
Other topics here tread edge for growing divisions. Fracturing. Going away mad’s.
The Charcoal insistent versus raw wood users.
Religious affirmations.
Chris you do this; you or someone will have to be the very active proven fair handed Administrator with the willingness, daily time, and power to quell the Insistent. The best-system missionary types. The Entertainer fools. The bored with their life’s, holes pokers.
Otherwise the here-is-what-I-am-doing-achieving-acceptable-results types will just walk away.
I saw the wind taken out of the sails of the MicroCoGen forum done by just two guys. One over controlling, biased by his prejudices. The other allowed to intrude with his only PV-Solar Green-Spin drums-beating, onto others projects and topics. Being a couch-potato always there able to jump on newbies, with his, my-ways-the-best greeter.
I became like others, long term vested, a walk-away in disgust.
Internet groups there are more ways to go wrong, sideways than not. So far the DOW is working for Practicalist’s, the Doers.
Steve Unruh
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DOW already has everything going for it in its topic selectuons. There are people on here that are regularly participating and they do not build gasifiers. I really like this learning from the other topics that are being used here. We already have a great platform going with its policies set up and in place I say start a new thread on homes of grid or homesteading that is like the WK premium site. It all goes hand in hand and we can include the full membership to go into the site to support it. One membership to DOW pays for both.
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What he is proposing has much greater potential as it would not be as a specific domain such as “Drive On Wood” and directly related content to gasification. This is looking in from the outside. We all that are here are looking in from the inside. So we know these other topics are exist. But if you never came here you are most likely are going think this forum is specific to vehical gasification installations and most likely wont even enter the site or even check it out. Even the small engine guys dont come on here because many do not know small engine and stationary is also supported. Very little of the the off grid, prepper and homesteading comunities even know gasification exist. So finding this is actually very limited. My own estimate based on FB groups is that maybe at most is about 5% that have any clue of gasification.
Nothing stopping Chris from implementing everything that makes this site great into the next.
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What we don’t want is this…https://youtube.com/shorts/L9wyJOHsY10?si=lOz_RvIubYi7bEL3
Obviously, this is an entertainment video. This example is from an endless click bait parade of “naked homesteading” videos.
I would like videos or lessons that really go in depth.
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This is true we do look from the inside out now we are members. When I first stumble on to this site I had no idea it was about wood gasification. If the DOW site had on the front page that would direct you to the other topics like the word (homesteading) or (off grid living) I would have check these topics out too.
I was building HHO units like you Matt. I built a beautiful Joe Cell but it would not run a ICE. Lol.
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I think what he is posting is too broad for the group expertise, we have people interested in the topics, some going down that path, but our expertise is more gasification. There are a ton of websites for homesteaders.
However, expanding from just driving on wood to encompass more uses of wood gasification could be made more apparent. I mean ‘Same site new look’ has been up on the front page for 2 years, and I don’t think friday night video chats have happened for at least the last 10 years. small engines aren’t included.
What we are missing are the normal influx of people looking for gas alternatives because of high prices. I don’t know whether that is because of EVs, and solar. Or whether because the far left created a social divide by attaching social justice and social change to the energy policy. Or whether it is simply people don’t know about it.
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Did anyone here ever belong to Homesteading Today. A huge homesteading site where if you were inexperienced or asked a question at least ten people immediately wanted to tell you why you were an idiot. I joined Northern Arizona wind and sun forum. Same thing. Just wanted some information. Got smacked around like a step child. After that I joined a homesteading site that was an off shoot from HT. At first it was great. Tons of projects and shared info. Then the members closed the open forum so they could feel safer discussing political subjects. New members had to be brought in by existing members and vetted. As the years went by people either died or moved on, many went grey, now it is just a few old and sickly geezers talking about their backyard gardens and aches and pains. I never convinced any of them that every thing they say on any forum is monitored. Big brother knows all. DOW has been the first site I have ever visited or belonged to that freely shares information and is only interested in helping new comers find a niche and fit in while cataloging a massive store of vital information.
We have managed to keep certain derisive boundaries at bay and wisely so. Still, the world is in turmoil and the folks that are becoming aware that their programming has led them in to a cage are desperate for some way out. Lifestyles based on independence is the only answer.
If government is involved, avoid it.
If government supports it, reject it.
If government says it’s safe, it’s not.
If government says it’s true, it’s false.
If government endorses it, question it.
If government says you need it, you don’t.
If government owns it, it’s probably stolen.
If government regulates it, it’s stifling freedom.
If government funds it, there’s a hidden agenda.
If government calls it progress, it’s likely regression.
If government is the solution, you are asking the wrong question.
Too radical? I don’t think so. We as a group have a totally impressive array of knowledge related to self sufficiency. Very little of it involves taking the easy way out. Driving on Wood, electrical power by producer gas, building structures, growing food, all hard assed work and not doable without doers to show the way and possibilities. Isn’t that what we are all trying to do for each other?
Drive on Wood is large enough now that it requires some expertise to find out basic essentials of making wood gas and operating machines with it. I think it would be better to limit input here to things more closely related to that line of thought and linking to a new site expressly devoted to other forms of self sufficiency. Either way, I am happy to be a part of this group. I believe it is one of the most valuable on the web.
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Can you post some links to what you’re thinking of? I haven’t found what I’m proposing anywhere yet. If it’s already out there, no need to reinvent the wheel.
I should stress that this idea is not meant to supplant DOW, only (possibly) exist alongside it. This website and community is perfectly functional as-is, and I’m not trying to rock the boat.
This whole topic was just to see if there was interest in a more homestead-focused site, given the amount of discussion around that.
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I have been involved with this subject for a long time. There are no homesteading sites that operate like DOW. There are a few that have excellent information available but are also heavily geared toward survivalist subjects. More than enough. Lord knows I’m a big fan of guns and ammo storage and religion should be a personal subject. Politics? I made my case up a few posts. Growing and storing food, methods of procuring water, building and tools. Things people have always required on this planet to survive and thrive. I didn’t understand that was Matt’s intent with TOG. Still one way or another I hope this happens because I have a lot of information I would like to share without further diluting DOW.
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Well expressed your thoughts now ChrisKY.
Would I join and participate? Probably not. That’s just me. I’m not anti-organizational as such.
People are who by their participation actually what condone all human social organizations.
It is just so hard to avoid the devout strident Believers, the Manipulators and power/contol-hungry in organizations. Small Town governments and Churches too. Been worn down by both too, too many times.
I’d rather just read and agree, or disagree with the book.
Still I and the wife do, and have been organization members and supporters.
The cub scouts and the Grange for me.
Cub Scout pack master for the wife; the v.p. of the Women Auxiliary of the VFW ; the Grange kitchen and children’s fair staff for her also.
Four-H has some very nice programs with values taught for the children we would join and support too. FFA does good works also for young becoming adults.
Organizations of community service. Declaring they are all about community service; and practicing non-denominational.
I can’t exactly say non-political as the Grange and the VFW do have legislative lobbying arms.
Anyhow. Here’s a not hot button name for a set-up you may try:
Living-Forwards
Regards
Steve Unruh (not a lurking couch potato. guardian of a dog with bladder cancer wanting out often. and with my own acting up prostate)
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Chris,
I think the DOW model is hard to beat. Let’s say we are trying to define the DOW. The central theme is pretty narrow and easy to focus on. It’s also easy to exclude unwanted topics because they aren’t directly related making internal combustion engines run on wood.
I read the DOW rules awhile ago and seemingly have forgotten them. I use common sense. Don’t swear, and don’t say anything that I wouldn’t say to someone’s face. Then I tone that down by 50%.
A homesteading website would have to be vary broad in scope. Very hard to stop keyboard warriors from destroying it because of all the agenda surrounding the various topics. I don’t know how homesteading could be limited in scope, enough to make it a productive website/forum.
DD-WRT forum is productive. It forces people to follow rules inorder to get help.
The TinyCore forum is terrifying in how horrible any request for help is treated by experienced members.
Chief Delphi (the First Robotics Forum) is very broad, in scope, but heavily moderated. Bad behavior is not allowed. There is some gentle sarcasm directed toward team members who ignore the requirements surrounding building the robots.
Biodiesel Infopop was a productive forum with flaming and bad behavior, but also very helpful people. It was broad in scope, and covered a lot of ground. It was like Reddit.
I think it would be interesting to build a trap. Have a paywall (steep price) for a section of the forum where rules were more relaxed and people could rant about their hair brained ideas. I wonder if people would go there and commit online suicide by losing all restraint.
I remember Mr. Sharkey’s House truck forum. He heavily moderated it and anything he didn’t like was arbitrarily removed, then he just closed it. I suppose heavy moderation is required but who? I would think it’s a full time job.
My conclusion is that I would be interested. I would be a member. I am a homesteader.
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I do agree that homesteading is way broader than wood gasification and we should tread carefully. Opening the floodgates to everyone and their brother… might be a mistake.
One difference at DOW from most of these is the paywall. How does that affect users attitudes?
Perhaps folks should have some “skin in the game” i.e. they’ve paid for a membership. I don’t want everything locked up behind a paywall, but if you’re invested in the site, you are more likely to keep it clean and civil. Maybe it’s invitation only, like some of these FB groups? That would weed out the casual internet trolls at least.
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This is almost exactly what I was envisioning.
Since it exists, I see no need to compete with it. I’ll probably give it a whirl and maybe reach out to them, there may be an opportunity to promote woodgas in there.
Thanks for all your feedback folks! This was an interesting discussion.
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I agree, you must have some skin in the game to be respectful of a site. As soon as free people come along and see where they can treat it like a tourist town they do. Yes I live in a low cost RV site in a tourist town to survive. People come here, get drunk, break rules of the town, think because they don’t live here that they can crap all over the town and leave when they please. Do we want this happening on this site? No!
I am quite selective of being a member of any group because I am interested in engineering, not drama. This site provides all the best of gasification.
Being quite open about my heart transplant, I know any time I have gotten since twelve years ago is a gift and I am trying to give away what I have done before dirt nap time comes around.
FYI I have to weld in a cattle pasture, can’t weld when the owners wife get worried about fires or one of the old women chides here into making me stop because they are jealous. No one comes way out to see I cut up the old truck and lined the ground around my welding table with sheet steel from the pickup, they just make things up without knowing anything.
Why this is important? This site doesn’t care about all that. They know I am heading toward a goal on a candy bar budget. It is a safe place and I will not be told I am heading in the wrong direction by a solar panel salesman.
Chris, please bring new topics and we can keep the intensity of this site. As some of the richest men in the world concluded, a country can only develop when it has freely available energy. I am a stationary engine guy. I have been working on rebuilding the inline six from the pickup I was given, actually abandoned in the field.
My intention is to make it into a welder, generator, heating and cooling unit as well as it’s own wood chipper for fuel. I am designing to be able to tow it around behind a truck that I can attach the line to the vehicle or to a field machine such as a sawmill or tractor.
My point is here is the best place to post that type of material, not a site that which looks at only one aspect. The idea could be homestead, because it is a low cost energy source, but it is really about gasification. If you want to use a gasoline generator site, go to one to get detailed information. Want to go solar, find a detailed site. Want easily built gasification with courteous experienced people, come here.
Too many words, but I think in details.
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I reference permies.com sometimes but sometimes the information and solutions are sketchy if they exist. The same thing with homesteader sites. They fixed a problem, but the solution isn’t as good as it could have been or they quickly fall back to retrotech. But they send me offers for books at least monthly.
What I would suggest, is changing the home page so it is more inclusive of other gasifier systems. We also need to settle on 1-2 designs for small engine gasifiers that are easy and work for newbies that is better written out. That could be premium. If you want to run a large engine we point to the book, the small engines… we have a lot of information but sorting through all the topics has to be a pain for a newbie.
Then creating a ‘homestead’ Topic, that can be either threads of people’s homesteads, or homesteading topics. Like ‘water systems’ or whatever else you have encountered. In fact, charcoal filtration is covered somewhere. Tom can add his knowledge as well.
Maybe it attracts more people or gets people more involved.
I still make charcoal but it goes to biochar right now. It is all low tech and not worth posting.
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I try not to re-invent the wheel… Check out this site, it is some great homesteaders and is doing great →
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I’ve created a new subcategory for Homesteading. Nothing else is changing, it is still officially “off-topic” for the DOW site. But there are a lot of discussions on the topic, so I thought a new category was appropriate. Several existing threads have been moved over there.
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