Thanks for the engine(S) pictures here BrianH. These expain to me much on the engines you are working with.
Caution though I destoyed two different Tecumseh four-stoke single cylinder engines doing exactly what you are picturing by direct charcoal gas fueling.
One cylinder bore killed with pulled through abrasive ash.
Then later the other (now with an ash separator) intentionally ran with unccoled charcoal gas just to see the engine effects. Again killed the 2nd used throw-a-way engine cylinder bore with hot fuel gas burning off the cylinder bore lubrication oil.
Fuel gas temp above hand held at you last metal fitting will be too high. This is ~130F/55C. at the exteror metal fitting = ~180F/82C actual gas temperature. These little engines are designed for the evaporative/phase change cooling with liquid gasoline fuels.
Hi Brian, A successful run at last! Now to tweek the system. The melted tyre will happen every time unless you cool down that oxidation zone. Get that engine exhaust fed into it. As Steve says, get a dust filter installed between the generator and the gas engine. When looking at the picture of your gas hose delivery set up, I see a ball valve on the gas line comming from the charcoal gas generator. It is partially closed. Why is it there? I do not have a valve in my setup, only a valve to regulate the air mixture. I have built a larger Simple-Fire that is on wheels. This makes for longer run times and makes it portable. I also added an oil drip to give some hydrogen to the charcoal gas. (bumps up the BTUs) I use a 12V start up fan to get the unit producing burnable gas. Takes about 4 minutes. Took only one pull on the engine to get it running. I am getting away from using gasoline for engine warm up and moving to just charcoal gas.
You are wondering if your charcoal fines can be fed into the generator. The answer is “yes”. Just need some method to get them in there.
Until later,
Gary in PA
Gary,
Are you dripping used motor oil (unthinned) into the air tube after the until is up to temperature? (I don’t see any black stuff oozing out of the air inlet.) How many drops/min? Are you filling this large tank with the small charcoal from your charcoal grinder, vs filling to within a foot of the top? Do you have water condensing near the top of the tank? I mention this because I sometimes see water vapor on the bottom side of the hatch cover on my Simple-Fire. The evolution of your Simple-Fire Updraft Charcoal Gasifier is amazing, and that leads me to inquire what version of input nozzle this unit has? Ray Menke
Thanks for the replies- I stuck the ball valve in as an extra option for the weaning process, and to isolate the gasifier while I get the engine running on propane- the little Kwacka seems very mixture sensitive. I’d agree that “priming” the gasifier with the flare fan seems to help, but I would lean more towards letting the engine vacuum do the work- I’m basically no fan of battery technology. A hand cranked fan, maybe, or back to starting on propane and running the 240v fan… to be decided. Quick questions on filters- is it worth the effort seeking out better filters from the car spares or vacuum cleaner shop, or will any old bit or sponge do the job perfectly? What sort of intervals do you get between cleaning? There’s an oil bath cleaner on the Land Rover- why doesn’t everyone use them?
Hi Brian, It seems that the smaller the engine, the harder it is to get started. Especailly if it is a single cylinder. By not using a start up fan to get the charcoal gas up to combustable conditions is a handicap. I also share your concern about battery suppliments to get your gasifier running. My head buzzes from time to time on developing a hand powered device to act as a start up fan. Maybe some day?!?
I hate “quick questions” because the answers are often complicated. Filters; Start off with open cell foam rubber. Maybe cover it with a piece of wool cloth to catch most of the inital dust entering the filter. (This was highly recommended by the Aussies in the 1940s) And it works well. The problem of adding more restrictive filtration is the choking effect it has on you poor little Kwacka. Unlike running on gasoline, it has to pull it’s low BTU fuel through a bed of charcoal and a filter. You can always add more filtration if you think it is necessary. Try the oil bath cleaner. I never have but someone out there may kick in with their experiance. The foam rubber is so simple, available and easy to clean, that I have not tried anthing else on the Simple-Fire.
Got to get outside and plant trees. Beautiful sunny day here in PA
Later, Gary
Hi Ray, Meant to get back to you sooner, but too many things going on, including charcoal. Just picked up three more school program to do. All shop teachers and really interested in charcoal to run an engine. Also biochar. One is a horticulture teacher and never heard of bio char. We have our work cut out for us. Also talked to a forester from Wyoming who wants to turn beetle killed pine into bio char. He says investor want to go big, but there are no turn key units avaiable or else the economics do not work out. Therefore he is thinking of starting “small” and working up. (Wow what a great idea!)
To get to your questions. The used motor oil is turned on when the charcoal is lit. Set to drip around one drop every two seconds. With a larger engine, you can drip it in faster. By the time the air is evacuated from the generator, filter and pipes, the oil is starting to show up at the air inlet nozzle. This takes four minutes on this large generator. At that time the gas is rich enough to flare and so far, takes only one pull on the engine to get it going.
This generator is filled to the absolute top with the same size charcoal I use in my other gasifiers 1/8" to 3/4". So far there has been no water condensing, but I am sure it will as the humidity goes up and the fuel bed decreases. There is so little condensation that I do not consider it a problem. From time to time I will check for water in the bottom of the air filter and dump it out.
Gasifier evolution? Actually, the only thing different about this wheel about unit is the height. It uses the same size nozzle, air inlet, gas outlet, fillter, and hoses at the other simple fires. The increased heigth just allows longer run time.
The oil drip is something I have also added to my other simple fire but is not necessary. I’m kicking around taking this to Argo if there is enough room in the truck.
Got to go get those trees planted.,
So until later, Gary in PA
Hey, that is neat! I am curious what the air inlet looks like. Will it be easy to put a pipe fitting on the air inlet side to pull the charcoal gas through the startup fan? You just gave me a different idea too. What about using this fan to “push” the charcoal gas through the generator, filter and lines? Do me a favor, let us know how this device works. Never knew such an item was made, so will do some more looking on my end.
Thanks for the info.
Gary in PA
I’ve seen a few hand cranked fans around, usually on mobile forges. If you’ve got horses around, it might be worth asking your farrier if he knows of anything.
Re. Forced airflow- a leaf blower or bouncy castle fan would probably work, I would, though, insult the intelligence of 99.9% of the people reading this by mentioning that once you make the jump from carbon monoxide production driven by a vacuum, to a forced gasflow process, there are some extra safety risks. I’d have a horrible vision of a 0.1 percenter Darwin Award candidate with access to an elderly relative’s oxygen cylinder.
Got three tweaks lined up for the weekend- a cooler and condensate trap (done), a filter (looking for inspiration) and exhaust recirculation (got a fair idea). To be continued when I get some MIG wire in the morning…
So… not much happening at the moment- I’ve been visiting my parents, but I did take the Sort of Rockety Stove to the Small World Spring Gathering with no real aspirations where it created a modest buzz of interest- I made a couple of buckets of char, Ross from Kaos Blacksmiths made a belt buckle with the char, I cooked some Pasta alla Carbonara, a lady cooked some lentils and stuff, and the car park stewards made some tea and kept warm on the horrible first night. I’m quite pleased with the Mk1 prototype- charcoal is the primary product, the heat is the spin-off, so… heat transferred to hot water, heat transferred to a flat surface for cooking, or heat radiated at torso level… the potential spin-offs just keep multiplying.
Managed to upgrade the SOR stove- I’ve changed what was a rather silly harvesting chute to something a bit more sensible, and added a higher flue, which has delivered a significant reduction in smoke. It’s working well with what it was intended for- lengths of pallet scrap, but so far, disappointing results with pellets. The dip in the middle is to produce a region of stagnant air for the char to collect, but I’m thinking that I could get the same result, with much easier fabrication, by putting a door on the charcoal end. At the moment, with no insulation, most of the heat seems to be radiated from the flue, and I can’t get a rolling boil on a wok full of water, but bearing in mind that the heat is a spin-off, I’m pleased with the results so far, and I’ve got a few ideas for the Mk3.
Managed to answer one question before close of play: what happens when you load a Simple Fire with wood pellets? It initially produces lots of dense white smoke- I suspect as the moisture evaporates, which can eventually be coaxed to burn, and it continues to burn quite nicely for quite a while, with a clean yellow hydrocarbon flame, which almost turns to a charcoal flame, then back, as pockets break up. The run finishes like a charcoal gas run, and on opening up, there’s a bit of condensed tar around, but nowhere near the worst case scenario of a tarry mess and no air flow. The pleasant surprise was: very little damage to a mild steel tuyere. What I’m thinking is: feed this gas into a charcoal gasifier to clean it up. To be continued…
Soooooooo… It’s the festival season at the moment, and I’ve been getting away at the weekends, so not much gasification at the moment- the focus is on the SOR stove, which brewed a round of coffees at the Summer Solstice Celebration, and cooked a foil parcel of stuffed mushrooms in the char harvest chute. I know what the next evolution is going to be, though.
One kick in the teeth though- insurance renewal time on the Land Rover, and it transpired that none of the insurance companies want to know about gasifiers:-( How it works in the UK is: you talk to the insurance brokers, explain carefully about proven hundred year old technology, and how it kept Scandinavia moving after WW2, to a skeptical call centre operator, they put you on hold while they speak to the underwriters, stuff gets lost in translation, and they come back with a thumbs down. The worst thing is other peoples attitude of “It’s uninsurable, so don’t bother trying anything new” …so it’s OK for insurers to strangle innovation at birth? Not much better is the attitude of “Don’t tell them”… I want to shout about my successes from the rooftops- I hate the idea of sneaking, creeping, and deception. Got to think about Plan B…
Hey BrianH this having to attiude shift isn’t anything new either.
Been millenia having to hide your best efforts from the self-promoted Noble’s “Sheriffs” Tax-Collectors.
Tricks are to ALWAYS give them somthing so they will think that they have won and go away untill the next go around. Means be meek and declare the Landrover for what it is now, not what you want it to be. Then have your “weekend use” events tow behind blacksmiths equipment trailer.
To go gypsy/biker/hippy and try and avoid it all really just makes you stand out for special attention.
To go Henry Wallace - Scot’s and declare your “rights” will give you the same with now even more extra special attention. (pick your own prosecuted/executed Irish/Welshman/Englishman and insert here)
Us Americans, Canadians, Australians have out own personal freedom independence declarers martyred we can relate to.
I happen to live in one of the most nanny stater corners if the US of A. dominated by save the trees Greens so have given this a lot of thought also concerning woodgas useage. No choice in this as “they” are still tring to make all woodfuel home heating illegal here in this land of trees.
Realities in my mind are:
There is only ever going to be enough appropriate useable tree woods to replace a small percentage of the Fossil and Dino fuels as used today. Look at the sites participation rates for woodgas/charcoal gas versus ANY 10X, 20X, 100X car/motorcycle enthusiast fossil/dino fuel using sites. Only literally one in a million moderns today are ever going to get using sustainable trees for fuel anyhow.
“They” ( the nanny staters) will keep hammering/yammering down on the personal energy consumption side. They even now have the established energy producers/investors singing the same songs now as long as they will support them in thier supply Monopolies. Be no common sense shown here. No common ground for accomodation of folding in wood energy as part of suite of energy solutions to move forward with.
Places where woodgas WAS used widely and State sanction and supported became regulated strangled for the individual use and even now as in Germany, Poland and parts of Sweden illegalized. So wide promoting will just backlash and restict it’s use for those few who will get it and see the sence of it.
I suggest a seeky bastard, Robin Hood, encroaching weed useage/promotion approach. Ha! Your choice in this. Do realize we most of us have already ran into the “If there is not enough chewing gum for everyone in the class then you can’t have any either!!” Any vehicle driving and openly promoting wood or charcoal fuels in the heavily Urbanized counties of Oregon or Washington States will get lots of jeers. Now do the same out in the Rural counties here and you will get cheers and asked how-too.
Magnetic signs, hats and Tee shirts come off quick and easy to blend in and back up easy and quick to shout out!
Mr Wayne from his earlier works now has dissapeared fully half of his system out of sight under chassis now and has worked especially hard to make these fast usable enough to not stand out but blend in with the crowd. Others like SeanF working hard to get rid of the refinery in the back appearance.
A few others of us now just so old, tired, gray & grizzled spent now we no longer give a damn and can take the “that crazy old coot man” approach. Popcorn Sutton’s.
I hope we will not have to start calling you Guy Faulks.
Plan B, for now. is to experiment with the vehicle stationary or off-road, add a raised air intake, carry an experimental gasifier on the roof rack, and modify the engine as little as possible. So, can I mix the air and gas at the top of the raised air intake without worrying how many litres of explosive mixture is just waiting for a spark? Flame arrestors anyone? I’m down, but not out.
Brian, I really feel for you right now. I may not be as far along as you with a charcoal gasser, but I have been beating the same thicket with regards to insurance. I have emailed around a dozen of the top end insurance companies, and not one of them has even taken the time to reply. I’m willing to start up a meaningful dialogue with their tech staff but nobody gives a damn. As you well know, our insurance companies are looking for any reason to void a policy to avoid paying out. I had to declare that my Escort van had an amber beacon fitted, and it affected my premium for having it on. I have to bite my lip when I talk vehicle insurance as it is really a one way street. How come my premium went up a couple of years ago after the heavy December snowfalls? I had enough talent not to crash, yet I’m getting punished for the insurance companies loosing cash on those who did?! Basterds (Yep, I misspelt it to cover up the language, but it’s a good description).
Worst of all Brian, it’s closed lips from the home teams too. I have sent numerous emails to the coffeecar team, questioning how they legally drove the Ford P100 around Britain, which they did, very publicly. What have I had back? Sod all!
I’m beginning to think stealth is the best way. Tow a trailer with high box sides and vent grills/mesh along its side panels. Then bring the gas pipe in under the tow hitch. If I get as far as a charcoal gasser big enough for a vehicle I was thinking an old hatchback like a Polo, 106, Fiesta or a Corsa. £300-£400 at most and if it all goes south and I torch the motor then it’s across the weighbridge and on to the next one.
Stick with it Brian. If I get a break in the clouds I’ll let you know, but for now it’s still raining…
Ah, yes. The Coffee Car team. I did get an email from Martin Bacon a while back saying that they used the BBC’s insurance for their London-Manchester run- they are keeping very quiet, though. I’ve sent an email to Dick Strawbridge, and I’ll try to contact Organic Power:
I suspect that it might have been a self-insurance arrangement, where the BBC act as their own underwriter, and earmark a million or so of licence payers money for claims. Freedom of Information Act? I wonder…
