You might look into a gas well engine, they rack up the hours. Not sure how well they would power a generator.
2 Likes
I think the key to long life on those engines is that they are slow speed engines that are probably not pushed to the limits. I believe thats key to long life on any engine. If I do this I might choose to oversize the engine to my generator somewhat and have it direct drive to run 1800 RPM only. Something similar to what MEN did in the early 80’s. May even be able to take a diesel engine and convert it to gas by lowering the compression some. Of course I will loose some efficiency though from the heavy mass of internals in the engine. All about finding that balance between longevity and efficiency. I know from my research that compression can be higher to improve performance. Or how about turbocharging? Anyone try that on a wood gas engine?
Both diesel conversion and turbo’s have been thoroughly discussed on this forum. Use the search function to find them.
Since you are a student of old mother earth news, you might remember a fellow who ran a 4 cyl pinto? engine for a couple hours every other day to pump water into an overhead tank and charge a few batteries, and that supplied all their power. At that time (early 80s?) he figured a dollars worth of gas each time he ran it. Now imaging running that on wood.
1 Like
Hi Curt welcome to DOW. You are probably at a much better starting point then most so getting to your goal will be more likely. With that in mind I thought I would respond. I don’t want to be preachy or try to portray my self as experty but I think that The trick to off grid that most people never seem to talk much about is you must alter your demands to match what you can make as opposed to trying to hammer the system into the life you have now. That is anathema to much of us here but Ignore that rule and expenses will drive you out of it eventually. Yes you can run a wood gas genny 24/7 that will match your peak load but designing a system large enough for starting a 5 hp compressor and running the steady loads of house and shop without batteries or inverter locks you in to a size that will idle most of the time wasting wood and possible causing high Temp, low temp conditions in the hearth. All my opinions of course.
Good luck, David Baillie
5 Likes
You will be amazed at what little power you can live with off grid and amazed how much power you have used when you were on grid and just left the lights on. When I get to fire my gasifier up to run my generator, rather than gasoline, then I will be even more aware. This is my ultimate goal. Drive on wood, power and heat with wood and run my tractor on wood. It all will happen in due time.
5 Likes
You bring very good points to this discussion. Perhaps I can do away with some larger motors like my air compressor. In the MEN article I believe they talked like they were going to belt a smaller compressor to run directly off the engine and run an air line. Perhaps I could get another compressed air storage tank for more capacity if I need it. There are always different solutions to these problems. Keep the genny smaller and averaging 50% load would probably be the best I am guessing. Trying to do laundry at night during off peak times for example might help even out the load on the genny.
Bill, I’m anxious to see how it all turns out with your system. I know the questions I will be asking myself is, will these systems pay for themselves in time. I know part of the deal is the interest we share in these projects so to me my time is free (well somewhat, lol) It would simply be a bonus if considerable money was saved.
1 Like
Hi Curt you get the idea. No need to loose electric compressor just size it for something modest that an inverter can start. I have a magnum energy unit that will run continuously 4800 watts, 7000 Peak my main compressor is a 1/2 horse I could do bigger though. I feed a larger tank if I want to use air tools. I have thought if I used the air more off the inverter I would hook up a second small compressor adjusted to come on at a slightly different pressure. Anything to shave that peak starting draw. Lots of tricks lots of forums out there.
David Baillie
1 Like
Get a truck compressor. It’ll need engine oil plumbed in. Next a 1000 gallon propane tank. Could also build a wind mill with an air compressor.
1 Like
Grid electricity is cheap when it’s available. For me it was the satisfaction of being able to make electricity. In that case, it isn’t a monetary thing. In my case now not having the grid available and needing a generator, now I have to pay per gallon, I believe it will pay for itself.
I can’t wait to get it all set up. I’ve been preparing for this for a while now.
6 Likes
For a wood gas generator one should expect the engine to be a consumable part of the system. Its better to replace an inexpensive engine vs a very expensive engine. I don’t care how industrial or good an engine is, its going to break and if any mistakes are made and tar gets in it, the damage is done.
If you set up a DC inverter charger, you can get away with more power. Its all a matter of what the inverter is capable of, and your storage capacity. This way you can pull direct from your genset or your battery bank. You can get your heavy loads from the inverter as these will most likely be peak power requirements. Then loading the generator is not so much a big deal and the battery bank will absorb this instead of the generator. This also allows you to only run long enough to create the power needed and you can then give the machine some down time and run off your bank. Another plus to this is you will have the infrastructure for wind and solar. We have had very good luck with the Aims inverters and they can be had in 12 kW with pure sign for relatively low cost. It all boils down to how much practicality you can afford to put into the system. The more you spend the more practical it will become to use.
If you are into Arduino some of us are already developing these advanced systems. I have a tutorial for an arduino air fuel mixture system on here. This little system works quite well and I would highly recommend this on a stationary system. Our machines run as stable as if they are running on gasoline with this and it also handles the heavy loading very nicely. I have some video of the Predator with this system under very heavy loading and that thing hardly skipped a beat welding on it.
Getting CHP is a great idea and a good way to make your efficiencies go up. But until you know for sure I would only plan on this to supplement a primary heating system. You’re only going to get maybe a third of the available btus from your fuel and that’s without all the conversion losses.
Ive been down many roads with this stationary systems. We love the DC set ups but unfortunately we could not market them. The better solution is to go with the AC system and tie the charger inverters into them. You then get the best of both worlds. 
4 Likes
Good morning Mr Ryder,
First of all I have seen your Vulcan gasifiers and your website and I think you have a neat business going. Its neat to be talking to guys that have experience with simply what works and what does not. From what I am reading these systems sound like they can be somewhat finicky because there can be so many variables. Hopefully with the use of modern electronics like Arduino like you said using an oxygen sensor and a mixing valve to provide the optimum mixture to the engine is a great idea to take some of the variability out of the equation when it comes to the mixture the engine is getting.
Now onto the subject of the engine/generator and appropriate sizing. When I initially dreamed up my system I was thinking of trying to keep it simpler. I was not thinking of battery banks or inverters. Yes it sounds like a neat idea to store power to be able to help a smaller genny run more optimally. I just dont like the added expense of battery banks and inverters. What if there was a way to put more variability into the gasifier? Forgive me if I sound ignorant on this as I havent built a gasifier yet. One could think of it along the same lines as a variable geometry turbocharger. Your typical gasifier could be thought of as your standard turbocharger. The engine with a standard turbocharger is probably not optimized in its efficiency untill 75 % load or more when the turbo is at or near peak boost. With a variable turbocharger the engine could be optimized at maybe 25% load already because the turbo is able to adjust itself to produce good boost at much smaller engine loads. It may sound silly but I wonder with the use of electronics if it would be possible to vary things inside the gasifier to always be at optimal gas production and cracking the tars well. You could have nozzles that could be shut off or turned on with solenoid valves. You could somehow vary the size of the hearth ( I know sounds impossible with temperatures that these see). Perhaps a sliding plate to cover part of the hearth…
Anyways unfortuneatly I am cut short on time. I will try to elaborate on this later. Thanks
I agree with David’s post. I have an 18kW Diesel for the farm’s back up. Most of the time it is burning .75gallons/hr to put out 1500W of electricity. Not very efficient, but it’s a domestic tranquility matter. For this reason I have settled on doing most of my wood gassing around the 6.5hp Predator/Honda GX200 generally in a 4kW. It’s a $99 engine that can heat and light my house 99% of the year.
Stephen
4 Likes
Hi Stephen, you make good points as well. A large genset putting out a very small percentage of power is going to use more fuel than a genset that is rated for that same amount of power, plus maintenance costs on the big one will be higher.
1 Like
The idea of the battery bank is to make the system practical to use. As mentioned above it will eat lots of fuel. The less practical the less fun. Get batteries from the junk yard if the cost is an issue. If you are going to build a gasifier a $2200.00 inverter plus your batteries is just a drop in the bucket.
For a part time system a gasifier is quite magical, the magic goes away though when the power goes out. So back up battery bank is a must.
2 Likes
Curtis, there is a Chinese company that sells wind-gens and wind-pumps. They say that a wind-pump will pump 5 times as much water as a wind-gen & electric pump. Something to keep in mind. A large air / propane tank is a very good idea. It gives you energy storage without batteries. I would definitely try a wind driven compressor. The farmer way is to take an old merry-go-round and strap on a bunch of half-barrels and a chain-drive. There are far more advanced VAWTs but, you can start simple.
All generatos except the latest type have to run at a multiple of 60 rpm. You won’t be going from idle to full load in an instant if you are already at 1800 rpm.
Before you burn osb, I would take a good look at the fumes from burning the glue. The idea of the turck air compressor is a good one. The older, smaller compressors are air-cooled and you don’t need water. They are however designed for a 20% duty cycle. Another alternative is to run a mulit-cylinder enging on wood gas and use one cylindr just for compressing air. Remember the old spark plug inflators?
If you’re looking for batteries, try to find somebody who has a connection to buy old telecom batts when they cycle them out.
2 Likes
Curtis, I´ve been falowing a guy called FLASH001USA, and he has comed up with a very good solution for stationary gasifiers. I have more or less your same problem and my idea is to build a WK gasifier with some adititions of Flash. My idea is to mount mine on a trailer and use if on my 1978 Jeep truck, on my ´95 Bronco and on our compresing woodgas system. I believe WK gasifier is the best I´ve found after reading and investigating woodgas for 3 years. By this we intend to make our ceramic ovens work with just one system due to the fact that for us anythyng we do is to expensive (I live in the Venezuelan Andies) and things in Venezuela are now days very rough. this is his youtube page: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxmB8LwVUzBvY83LbtzuDWw
I think a hybrid could be a good solution.
I am pursuing a similar set up.
My setup:
Gasifier: Ben Peterson design with mods
Generator: 26 kW brushless
Engine: Ford 351W ( repurposed engine that I rebuilt) Approx 5 k miles on it
Wind: 3kw Genesys
Solar: 7.2 kw (MX solar, Trina solar, Outback, Midnight solar)
I will run the gasifier primarily at night, when there is no sun in the summer.
Slightly sorry to be “that guy”, but the sun usually doesn’t shine at night during the winter, either. 
3 Likes