Max Gasman's Nissan Micra project

Have no sea-side island plans before the Audi and Micra are in order; the Micra has got its “new” 1,2 liter scrapyard motor, compression pressures very eaven at 14 Bar in every cylinder! Sings a merry tune…


“Hey Max, What is a Micra ???” - Mike LaRosa


Hi, Mike!

Hi, Mike!
At last answering 28.5.2014. Micra is a small 5 person car made by Nissan.
The model is K10, made between 1982 and 1993. Carburettor 1 liter models, and from -90 also the first cathalysator models with lambda sensor controlled carburettor.
I got a scrapyard motor from -91 1,2 liter 63 HP (had cathalysator that I skipped) to the -86 car. The car has now got Mercedes 190 modified and re-cured back springs, about 30% stronger than the original ones.
It is a project for a “hearthless” gasgenerator for sawdust and small-size fuel.

Max

Good luck Max, Post a few pictures as the project moves along … I moved my red truck to lower grounds and away from the big dead maple … Pulled my black truck up the driveway … Tornado watch tonight … I don’t suppose you have those things in Finland ??? Regards, Mike L

Hi, Mike!
Good starting point: 63HP/0,645ton = 97,7HP/ton… there are two versions; with compression ratio 9:1 60 HP, with 10,1:1 63 HP
I think I have got the 10,1:1 version, while the compression pressures are

1 = 14,0 Bar
2 = 14,0 Bar
3 = 14,2 Bar
4 = 13,9 Bar

It has been a “garage cat”, not used to outside air… and weather.
Last fall the Micra got new shocks.

It has to get two beams on the floor reaching out below the tailgate to carry the “woodgas shelf”. A parallellogram mechanism will lower the shelf to the ground when opening the tailgate and bunkering.

Not real tornadoes, but electrical district lines have been cut by falling trees.

Max

Good Morning Maxgasman
Hopefully AdminChris will read your’s and MikeL’s exchanges, pull these out and set you up with your own “Max’s Micra car Project” topic.
Ha! Ha! You had me really Internet digging to find what a Datsun/Nissan Micra car was.
Front wheel drive. Inline water cooled four cylinder.
Seems these were never into the US imported. Some did go into Canada.
Closest US imported Datsun/Nissan model would be the larger, heavier B11 model beginning in 1984 as the “Sentra” replacement for the older rear wheel drive Datsun 1200’s and then Nissan B210’s here.

Fella’s a “bar” of pressure is 1 atmospherics’ weights worth of pressure. Times 14.5 for your PSI.
Surprised me to find looking up bars’ origin that it was British.
Not surprised then that the SI folk been trying to “depreciate” it in favor of kPa/cm2.
Look under the hood of any North American car after ~1990 at the radiator cap. Will say .7, .8,.9, 1.1, 1.3 pressure rated.
That is bars of system pressure they are referring to. So you have been using bars all along.
Like using mach numbers as being multiples for the speed of sound in air for really fast in atmospheric speeds.

Gee Max.
I am disappointed. I had hoped your Micra project was going to be a stationary engine-generator.
As cut sawdust fueled I hope?

Regards
Steve Unruh

Hi, Steve!

Before 1971, and the SI reform, it was kp/cm^2 = kilopond/cm^2
And still older, the Atmosphere!

You will have good time to cool down your disapointment; first in row stands my Audi, which waits for a complete new-build of whole the filtering system…
The Micra has many constructional challenges to solve, before a newbuild will be started. The list is long. Scrapyard- and commercial lids have to be found, custom mantels to be rolled, cooler tubes, piping, feed-throughs, vents and flaps…

And after all, what is the reason for a disapointment?
It is more “Italian” than my Fiat Fire 1,1 liter with Bosch Jet TBI.
5 step gearbox, fast, light and smooth + silent. Steady like a train on the road, almost immune to sidewind.
It may become the smallest woodgas car in the country, but not the slowest.

Yes, sawdust and smaller than egg fuel, with no metal hearth.

Max

Thank you Chris!
Are the descriptive items also transferred here, to be under one “title” to better control what is written and what is not? Duplicating is not easy; its hard to be consequent…
Max

Thanks again, Chris!
I did not realize, that it all was under way already!
Tank you, Chris!

Max

Max, Storms just dumped rain (1"+) here last night and wiped out my driveway to my shop but we had 3 tornados in the area last night … I hear our only Kentucky Fried Chicken and Taco Bell is in rubble … Also the McDonalds … I rarely go there but ??? I like an occasional burrito … Wife likes the mashed potato and gravy and the MSG in the chicken batter … Supposed to get more of the same tonight but I think it has lost it’s fury … The news hounds eat it up … Herb called me today. He is on his way to Nashville and will be laid up for a while with chemo and blood transfusions to get his stem cells put back in … Let’s hear it for Viet Nam and agent orange. All he did there was work on trucks and change tires etc etc … I hope to drive the wood truck his way in a month or two … Mike L

Mike,
The orders to spray Agent Orange on us didn’t come from Hanoi.

carson,
1st Cav, 70-71

1 Like

Hello max
Good to see you now with a stand alone project topic.
You CAN projects mix here as you want. This IS your topic section.

I am interested to hear your newest ideas for filtration. Last I knew you had the whole top of the Audi involved with a big open cell foam filter? Blowing soot bubbles?

My small stationary systems I am satisfied with just washable stainless steel scrubber pads. Single and twin cylinder engine the intakes are easy to clean.

Regards
Steve Unruh

Storms, rain, human struggle. Hi, Mike! I keep my fingers crossed hoping for a good end result!

Max

Hello, Steve!

In both projects, the circumstances dictate the options almost mandatorily…
Still, in both cases the first filtering device will be a twin-cyclone, directly attatched to the generator; hanging high, convenient to “click, click” detach and attach, carrying away the lower part bucket to empty it safely.
As it gets hot resonably fast both in the summer and winter (insulated), there will be no wet porridge and emptying is elegant, fast, and clean, provided you stand in sidewind.

On the Audi the gastube has to make a bend over the open trunk lid and in the summer go parallel with the 1,1m long dishtable basin to its front gabel in order to get enough cooling to dew point. In winter, it is led in to the basin from the back gable.

So, this is a wet system with two matress pieces of open cell matresses
superposed on each other with ss net under and above, to form “manifolds” to spread and collect the wet gas.
Basin measures: 110 X 50 X 20 cm.
About 1" inside the back gable there is a bulkhead (avoiding low corners) to collect the filtered gas from above the upper ss grid on the mattresses. It is taken out near the lower right corner, fed back to the gasgenerator righthand lower part for last condense separation before rising up for re-heating in a “smuggler cannister” before final paper filtering on the back side of the gasgenerator.
(identical bucket as for the twin cyclones). From there over the rised trunk lid on the right side of the basin to the right hand windshield pillar and down into the right wing and finally into the motor compartment.

Condense is taken out from the basin in the righthand lower corner with a 1 1/4" rubber tube to the bottom end of the condense separator for the gas at the gasgenerator’s righthand lower part. (There is an internal bottom between the condense separator for gas and the condense tank proper). They have individual draining.

The Micra is quite a different “animal”. There I have to arrange all the components on the gasifying shelf. There will be only one connection delivering ready prepared clean dry gas. It has to be a hose bent in a wide bow, as the shelf has to swing backwards and down at bunkering and opening the back hatch.
Again, twin cyclone attatched to the generator “barrel”. Gasgenerator and dry filter in identical barrels with as far as possible, identical lids and outlets. The gasgenerator is planned to have a condensing “stack-mantel” and gutter in the upper half and an emptying plane with a “visir” about 2 1/2" above barrel bottom, to assist at inspection and test emptying.

At the upper end on the front side a bendable (shower-type) metal hose delivers starting air from a blower (always connected route with back-flap). On the opposite side the twin cyclone takes care of the heavier dust and soot. Lower down gasification takes place in an experimental fashion.

The (left) barrel contains a “flamenco-skirt” filter with “hoola-hoop” rings keeping the circular volangs out near the inner mantel. The gas from the twin-cyclon can is fed tangentially in between the two mantels, and depending on ambient temperature, more or less of the inter-mantel space can be used for cooling or insulation sheets pushed down between them.
The gas will find its way down and enter the inner mantel from below, where the ash and soot is piling up.
The lowest filter volang is kept about 1’ above the bottom for ample storing capacity. The center tube is wide to keep the volangs as vertical as possible, and providing good room for the reheating pipe.
This wide collecting center-pipe is hanging in a “full-diameter” (barrel inner diameter) plane gastight to the barrel wall. The lower end of the collecting tube is closed.

From the wide collecting pipe in the center, the gas is taken out at the upper end, out to the cooler lower tank with a separate tube.

From the coolers upper “collector”-tank the cool gas is taken back in with another tube and directed down and up into the wide collector tube, where the filter volang “waists” are attatced. This visit down and up in the collector tube is for re-heating the wet and cool gas so it can be fed to the paperfilter in the can sitting on the backside of the filter barrel.

So, the paper filter sits in its can on equal hight facing straight back identically as the cyclone on the gasifiers back side.

If the Flamenco filter fails, then it will be the ALI BABA SS finest mesh, pointwelded to straight tubes…

Max

Good Morning Max g.
Thank you for the walk through responce.
I re-read your edit copy. Good. You are filter system sane and useable.

Max your intro post said you were weary of “agenda, agenda, agenda”.
I certainly wearied of idealist, futuristic “someday” designing/building based on a Hollywood’s screen writers fantasy scrip. It was like chasing for the elusive fountain of youth, or lead to gold dreams. Only with real blood, sweat, tears and today money.
I have found here on the DOW that the actual site name words are the agenda.
DRIVE (IC spark piston ignition engine shaft power for a use) ON (doing/using) (real) WOOD.
So, less talk/speculations. DO MORE with actual today available IC piston engines and wood fuel.

I think you will like this agenda here.

As a premium member you can bring up my members page from my name anywhere in blue and view into my now 9 pages of photo’s. A lot of ME in those photo’s. How, Where I live. WHY and for WHO that I woodgas make and use. Ha! Even one back side photo of the actual me. (in PNW loggers clothes)

Your, “the circumstances dictate the options almost mandatorily . . .” speaks to the base core gasifier truth.
My work and desire for home based self-generated electrical power fueled by site grown wood dictates all of my system decisions choices.
Example: cyclones.

Max my small generator engines need all of the parasitic power draws removed as much as possible. I was encouraged a few years ago to stop thinking cyclones and switch to very large heavy slowed gases velocity long paths settlement chambers. Less pressure drop loading on the little engines to have to suck. Mine in my picture album was a 1st?, 2nd? generation concept. Ash and soot settled out of the producer gas. Ash and soots settling into a slide out SS catch pan was introduced on the 3rd generation.
Rapid cooling still kept above dew point seems to help much with this dropping out. WayneK evolved to doing this independently too. My “bin” cooling dropping out system uses gas heat to wood fuel bit condition by drying just-in-time, pre-hopper. What I cannot show is the actual active elements inside the “bin” assembly to increase soot dropping and for temperature control. Not my design. Now patented by the developer. The basic consepts of three benefits in one constuction are still sound and can be applied out, however.
THIS “bin” system to be effective weighs as much as your whole proposed Micra system will weigh.
Has nearly the same space footprint.
This combo unit would HATE to be vehicle or roads shaken. Stirs back up the settles ash and soots. HOT, dry filtering.

Stationary I have the space to try much that would be vehicle impossible.
Example: my gasifer building is still an open ended 5.8 meters by 12.5 meters. If I want I could put in a 6 meter length of 200mm cast iron sewer pipe horizontal at a say 3 degree slope. Introduce the hot, wet, dirty producer gas at the one end. Allow to flow though, cooling, condensing, washing. Concurrent flow; or, reversed counter-concurrent flow. Add different slide-in impingement elements. Fill with wash stones, ect. A WET system for sure!
This building has NO heat other than the gasifier/engine/gnerator system. I need heat. Or install a wood stove and then have another wood slave to feed.
Some kind of evolved wall “pipe” configuration would be able to prove useable for my engine-generator if I had not been given this “bin” system to use. Nothing new here. Usually pipe systems usually seen as vertical tubed coolers/condensers/washers. I’ve seen racked held pipe serpentine versions now in metals or plastics. MikeL’s GMC for one.
The “new” is here: raw wood fuel bits “V” trough held against this big pipe, raked down from the one end to the other as they dry and condition. Remember I am stationary, roof covered.
This brute, heavy, spread-out “simplistic” Combo purpose would be impossible on a vehicle or a portable system.

Ha! Ha! The problem some of us have now is whatever we are seen doing will be seen to be as the universal “ideal” ANSWER.
Welcome to the club brother Max. I declare you my Senior.
So I get to kick back and just sleep now, yes?

I am learning now to say, “go ahead and YOU try that” to the people with much suggesting but little to no doing. Maybe they will have better suscess. On 100% known fails to just say (colloquially), “Good luck with that”.

No majic do-all, for-all, answers to this. A RANGE of possibilities. A RANGE of decision choices we each must make.

On your systems descriptions:
by gable - you mean the basin end wall out of the top cover
basin is an actual SS sink basin now “roof” top covered
this is located within the Audi’s trunk area (boot)
you are useing a single condesate collection vessel internally divided for the different pressure areas (wise - some tried to short cut WayneK’s version of this and learned why not)
you are using the modern Swede/Finn way of pressure hearth blowing for starting up
Flamenco is a searchable trade/brand name for a paper filter system
“volang” means? step? shelf? pleat? ring?.

I will leave you to explain gas reheating.
Not done here yet by anyone that I know of including myself.
Only mentioned by Dutch John. Then none asked.
(hint group: lets him be able to use that Flameco paper? filter without, hopefully, wetting destroying it?)

Regards
Steve Unruh

Presenting - explaining - re-explaining?

A miserable presenter seems to have a lot to explain…

– Audi: When I said that the outlet from the cyclon-can behind the gasgenerator top has to go over the uplifted trunk lid, it means that it continues going forward to the front gable of the dish-basin on the roof of the car.

– Micra: The filter barrel contains a Spanish Flamenco-skirt-type of high temperature filter textile, ~7m^2. A continuos textile “tube” ~33 cm in diameter, 7 m long. It is arranged in 7 bagrings upon each another. “Waist” 10 cm high on the central tube for each bagring = volang.
Between each waistline in the volang there is a hoola-hoop keeping the lowest part of the volang out near the inner mantel.

– As already described, the textile-filtered gas in the central tube is led out at the top and down to a tube cooler’s lower tank. From the upper tank = “collector”, the gas is led in a tube back into the center of the filterbarrel and down and up inside the wide central tube. When comming up, the reheated and now dry gas is fed out backward and through the wall of the barrel, to get its final filtering in a truck-size paper filter.

– This has been done for decades with success; warm dry gas, equally clean as the secondary air the motor is used to have! On the way to the gasmixer, the warm gas can cool off again, but if it does not go down to the same temperature level as it was leaving the cooler, it will stay dry.

An exhausted Max

Thank you max for the clarifications.

I apologize for my babbling, seeming to be explaining the obvious to you.
I did go back and edit.
I have a progressing brain deterioration problem that has made it harder and harder for me to write and read with clarity.
For months I just went silent. Wife has made me now take medication for this and other other memory problems.
I hate being now medicated parrot Steve more than any can imagine.

Exhausted too. Just want to sleep away 20 hours a day.
Again. Thanks for the explanation.
My explanation of who I was, and why I was is really in my pictures anymore.
Just like woodgas. Those who understand, will understand.

Bast Regards
Steve Unruh

In the treatment pool most of us are, or will find ourselves sooner or later. That is unavoidable, if not abrupt incidents make it shorter.

But while awake, let’s enjoy the daily mistakes and achievements!

MIDSUMMER is a Fennoscandic ancient festive tradition with bonfires on skerries and inslets, to celebrate the longest day of the year.
(since christening also called Johannes, the babtist’s day)

I have to withdraw the stupid, mellow, hasty placing of the re-heating tube from the flamenco-filter’s centertube!
The “ice-cold” return-tube from the cooler would cause surface condensation of the mellow tempered 1st filter gas, which is not very high above the dew point as such. (especially in the winter!)

This would be straight against my own principal of fast re-heating of the gas after cooling. (fast after starting)

This is very important, and a warning example is Dutch John’s mediocre reheating with a cooling liquid battery for re-heating! (in the VOLVO)
The same mistake has been made by Eerin Rosenström!

I got Fredrik Ek to put the reheating DIRECTLY on the gasifiers output tube, and he has NEVER had any troubles by constructual causes.

Fredrik Ek has though (once) let the condese raise up into his matress-filter, and that way, through the re-heater (steam)-flooded the paper filter, but that is another story, as Kippling says!

So, back to the original (working) placing!
That would be staight on the connecting tube from the cyclone-can on the gasgenerator to the filter barrel. The paper-filter in its “can” can remain on the back-end of the filter barrel. Oh!

It is nice to see obvious stupidities before putting things physically together!

Besides mistakes:

Who is the pseudonym “APRIL WOOD”? And in which part of the planet does he live?

Max

Hi, Mike!

Oh! I see. Longest day of year celebration.
Tonight at my oldest Sisters. Outdoor all-invite fish fry. Celebrating all in the families with June birthdays. Her at 65. Her oldest daughter at 40.
Next month, or the next, we will invent another all-get-together reason for those months Birthday people.
Good fellowship, eat much, drink little, and be merry.

Why not hot engine exhaust to producer gas re-heating? Too far distance? Pick-up trucks are close for this.
REgards
S.U.

First hot, first served!!!

You jump in the same barrel as Dutch John and Eerin Rosenström!

The heatexchanger MUST be hot BEFORE floating gas to the paper filter!

The paper filter does NOT tolerate wet start up gas!

Who is APRIL WOODS?

Happy Celebration!

Max

Hi Max!

Do you have a camera? You know that they say a picture is worth a thousand words.

Don M