We live in interesting times

Yes Wallace, Truth is Truth, and Selfless Love is the way so everone may receive it freely.


That sounds dangerously like socialism… :wink:


There is no need to get riled up by other people’s opinions. If you are not interested in exchanging viewpoints, then you do not have to. And of course, you can simply not read any of this if it doesnt interest you.

However, you did see fit to post your opinions, and it raises a question for me. Who exactly are you accusing of using the threat of violence to compel people to act in a social manner? Everyone who works pays into social security, for example, and I believe the IRS would simply fine you if you didnt pay it.

I think the notion of each individual working for the common good out of the goodness of their hearts is a noble idea - and one that probably would have worked in the small groups that humanity spent the vast majority of its time living in. But as groups became too large to know every member, we lost the ability to compel group loyalty by reputation alone. (we can take up the notion that there is no such thing as a selfless act next:) I was reading this theory put forth as the reason so many cultures invented the idea of an all-seeing vengeful god. I think government fills a similar role as religion - and in theory it gives people a voice in deciding what should be considered right or wrong. I think if you look at who wins by this smear campaign against the idea of socialism, you will find that its once again the billionaires. They are not going to be pulling social security checks, why do they want to pay in to it?


Nope the church just depended on peer pressure and shame.


I love this quote…


We live in good times if we can talk gentleman like and respectful…

it becomes interesting when for some reason we should not or could not…

i love conversations, they teach me a lot , give me insight in other opinions and even make me change my mind sometimes…

as any conversation brings together, i avoid things that brings apart…


I have to say, I’m rather taken aback by the kind of hostility and intolerance of contrary views that I’ve seen here a couple of times. The above example, and some years ago over the topic of climate change.

Though I don’t follow right wing talk radio, it seems to be having some very negative effects on the level of consideration for other views, or even basic points and simple factual information. I gather somewhere in right wing circles socialism is equivalent to devil worship.

Though it might make a good talking point to argue against, as Carl pointed out, our societies have pretty much universally organized around principles of group help. The only diehard individualists have always been the wealthy, as pointed out, they don’t want to share, and are doing uncommonly good, having made off with the lion’s share of profit from working men’s labour by various means… The rest of us need and greatly benefit from government services like air traffic control, food inspection, old age pension, labour laws describing minimum wages and safe working conditions, etc, etc. And thank goodness in Canada we have state organized healthcare, as most advanced countries do. To be human is to be social.

The fewer people left behind, the better a society generally is.

We could talk about the guy who beat the money lenders, or served the poor and downtrodden, and told the rich their wealth would lead them to hell. He wasn’t exactly a Wall street cheerleader.

Getting back to the other matter, it’s really disturbing to see such attacks on factual information regarding climate change. No amount of anger will erase science, or reverse the growing disaster. And as the scientific basis steadily increases, the room for denial is vanishing. How bad, and how fast is about all there is to discuss.

Is this what is described as the post-truth world? It’s going to be very hard to learn anything if topics are forbidden because of anger without reflection.


Well your going to believe in stuff or your not.
Trying to change minds is almost impossible when the finger wagging and hostility starts.
Much better off having a calm discussion like we have managed here so far
Except there will never be agreement on all things.
Work towards common goals and common ground where the disagreements are less important.
We accomplish more when we build on what we can agree on even if its not completely to everyone’s liking.

My Grandfather had a saying he repeated to me often when I was angry and frustrated.
" Do you know what they do in China when it rains ? They let it… "


this is one forum topic I wish was on another forum instead of Drive On Wood. :frowning_face:


There are other places but usually they are full of crazy people.
Ideological echo chambers where everyone agrees on the same things, vilifies dissenting points of view and you never learn anything new…

In time this will run its course and we will move on.
Maybe I learn something from it.


I promise to avoid mentioning politicians if all y’all will avoid mentioning climate change.
I only mentioned big sweeping changes that are just part of the march of history. I didn’t step on anybody’s toes.
I believe that we can talk about interesting times without focusing too close on day-to-day stuff.
All you need to say about politician is; Power corrupts and , attracts the already corrupted. Leave it at that and try to ignore the blighters.
As far as charity, we feel good when we do it voluntarily, not so good when we are squeezed for it.
Centuries ago, the monasteries had an “almondry”. This is where they took in alms to disperse. Life was much more precarious in those days. You never knew when you might be on the other end of poverty.
There is STILL little recognition that the entire balance of the economy is being destroyed by automation.
An un-named person at the TOP of the foodchain said; A.I. won’t be taking any jobs for the next 50 to 100 years.
Marvin Gaye said; "believe some or none of what you hear and, half of what you see.’ . Heard it Through the Grapevine.
Cling to and nourish your families and faith. Tune out as much of the world as possible.
I write an economic blog to try to filter out the lies and confusion for people who can’t spend 40 hrs a week wading through the BS.
There is one good development that I see. The development of hypersonic missiles means that the politicians are at the front lines. The king no longer has archers between him and his enemies.


lets assume that all good people here wants to avoid problems and that we all really care.

The interesting thing in this time is the need is there to change…

Using wood for our daily energy need is a good starting point to actually making a change

It is exactly that what we are doing here on DOW, making a change and sharing knowhow on how to do so…

I don’t mind that my left brain half needs the help of your right brain half, coz we share the heart…

we don’t need to discuss what came first, chicken or egg, since both of them are needed just to be there…

Lets keep our words where our heart is, where we all agree upon, wood is good…


I’ve been watching this one for awhile. I appreciate the civility you all have mustered here. Usually semi-political discussions heat up much faster - which is why politics are not allowed. However this topic has not broken any forum rules. If it turns political or heats up at all I will immediately shut things down. As it is, the discussion may continue.

However this topic is already making a lot of folks uncomfortable. In the interest of keeping everyone happy, I will point out the forum controls.

At the bottom of every topic, there is a button which may say Normal, Tracking, Watching, or Muted. This is the control for your personal view of this thread. If you set it to “Muted”, it will disappear forever (for you). That may interest a few of you.

You can also mute entire categories. If you only want to see woodgas related posts, mute the “Off Topic” category completely. Go to Categories > Off Topic > in the right side there’s a dropdown, choose “Muted”.

Note that thread controls override the category control - if set to Tracking or Watching, it will still show in the list of topics even though the category is muted. Any thread you post in automatically gets set to Tracking. The theory being, if you’re posting, you must be interested. So, you may have some “clean-up” to do if you want them to ALL disappear. Change it from Tracking to Normal.

But then you might like having a select couple of threads from Off Topic. Like the “Life Goes On” thread.


I really don’t think you have too Chris.
Looks like its run it’s course.
We have not solved the worlds problems but we have shown our better natures and civility have proven there is room to talk about decisive issues.
Where the way of dialog and compromise leads I am not sure, but it starts with good people that will talk to each other and listen instead of rant.

Drive on wood best forum on the net!


Bring it on, the more the merrier! If every household has a small greenhouse with hydroponics essentially everyone could be a somewhat self sustaining farmer.


Interesting. How do you make sure the plants get the right amound of everything?

I am more into permaculture.

If Sasquatch would read this whole thread he might think of Wolfgang, from the show Laugh-In, and think “very interesting - but stupid.”

Silly humans should live a day with us.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

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Honoring separation requests I’ll post here. All OK here
9.0 Cascadia prepped we are good for 3-6 months. We’ve all (5 years to 67) cycled through weird colds with sore throats. Maybe . . . . . no home internet. No more public computor internet
Just dumb me on a borrowed smart phone on bootlegged WiFi My best to ALL S.U.


Just a couple of interesting items from the news.
Idaho just had an earthquake over the center of the Yellowstone magma chamber.
Here is some good news;

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