Drying fuel directly with exhaust gas, a solution to the water problem?!

A recent post on a monorator design has been active. The discussion turned to other ways of drying wood fuel including solar kilns and exhaust gas. Rather than reply there with my exhaust gas idea I’m making my own post because it is long. My use case is a stationary generator, and this idea is cheap but bulky and heavy… not for vehicles! With that caveat:

I’ve been kicking around direct exhaust heating/drying of wood fuel. By direct, I mean having the exhaust gas pass through and in between the fuel rather than heating the fuel container like a monorator. There is a lot of heat in engine exhaust but also a lot of water, approaching fully saturated. If you just run the exhaust straight into the fuel charge you get a wet mess (I am told) so it can’t be that simple. On the positive side for exhaust… it is virtually oxygen free which becomes important for drying combustibles as temperatures approach auto ignition temps.

Engine exhaust would be great if it didn’t have so much water in it, so… how do we dry the engine exhaust but also keep it hot so it can dry our fuel? A counterflow heat exchanger would do it but, you’d exchange hot wet low oxygen exhaust for hot, dry oxygen rich atmospheric air. Good but not ideal. The heat exchanger would need to be metal b/c the high temperatures would melt plastic. Metal fabrication, sealing and the like would be a challenge, especially for DIY and costly. How do we fix all this in one go?

We have two big pipes filled with rock, say coarse gravel or small stones. The pipes are laid out side by side like some giant double barrel shotgun. I haven’t run the numbers on the right sizing, but sewer pipe and rocks are cheap so going big isn’t costly. Nothing is pressurized and a perfect seal isn’t necessary. Preferably the rocks don’t absorb water easily for reasons that will become apparent; but if that becomes an issue, surface treatment with water glass would fix it (also cheap). You want the pipes to have a large volume for slow gas speeds, plenty of thermal mass, plenty of dwell time for heat transfer.

The big pipes are tipped down slightly from engine side to far side with a drain at the far end. At the end nearest to the engine are baffles that can switch the engine exhaust from one pipe to the other depending on the setting. The baffle directs exhaust gas to one pipe, heats up the rocks in the near end but by the far end the exhaust has lost enough heat that the water has condensed out and cleared through the drain. Over time the rocks heat up and at some point the far end will get hot enough that condensation doesn’t finish to our satisfaction. When that happens, we switch to the other pipe and repeat the process.

Here is the slightly cleaver part. The pipes are joined at the far end so that the cool exhaust comes back through the other pipe making a u turn. After one full cycle using both pipes in turn, the near end rocks in both are hot-hot-hot, while the far end rocks are still cool. When the exhaust gas makes its u turn and travels back through the second pipe will be reheated progressively by the stored heat in the rocks and exits the second pipe at near engine exhaust temps but now it doesn’t have all that water in it, perfect for drying fuel.

You cycle between the two pipes as one gets saturated with heat and the other cools off. Depending on the size of the pipes and the thermal mass it should be some minutes but not hours or seconds. When the gas switches direction you have a slug of exhaust that isn’t well dried so switching frequently isn’t good. The limit for switching slowly is the thermal mass of rock and too much thermal mass will slow the start up time so it is worth avoiding extremes.

So basically, this has the advantages of a counterflow heat exchanger, but it reuses the same gas instead of exchanging it like a heat recovery ventilator would. The regenerators in a Stirling engine serve a similar function and were my inspiration. Stirling engine regenerators must cycle very quickly which is a huge design challenge; we can go slow and slow is a lot easier.

The system builds up heat over time, so you’ll need a “heat sink” at the far end to keep the cool side cool. There are many ways to do this but a water coil would give you free hot (hotish) water and that my head design. Most of the heat that goes in comes out, so the heat sink doesn’t have to work too terribly hard. I have thought a few steps further on various issues like that and their ready solutions. The post is already long so I’ll stop here and follow up if there is interest.

Why am I being such a nutter about super hot drying? Well… I wanted to see if I could torrefy the wood fuel (or close) solely with waste heat and those temps are no joke. I had to push the design pretty hard.

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Hello,

This is a very interesting topic, thank you.
I look forward to hearing more.

I have a question: since gas is humid, couldn’t we heat the combustion chamber with a thermally conductive wall to prevent moisture from reaching the fuel?

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Since gas is humid, couldn’t we heat the combustion chamber with a thermally conductive wall to prevent moisture from reaching the fuel?

Yes, but you need a lot of heat transfer to dry the fuel. While steel or aluminum has great heat conduction other steps in the chain do not: Wood, (still) exhaust gas and (still) hopper air does not conduct heat well at all.

You need a lot of turbulent gas flow against both sides of that conductive wall and within the wood fuel to get the heat where it needs to be. It is a solution to the problem, but it isn’t as simple as holding the wood in a hot container. You need gas movement, condensing surfaces and condensate removal.

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You also have to have the correct presure when dealing with moisture dropping. You cant really do it in a vacuum effectivelly.

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There is water in the exhaust yes but it carrys a lot of energy. Passing exhaust over raw wood will make it wetter, yes, but only untill the wood reaches boiling point. Since exhaust temp is a lot higher thain waters boilung point the superheated steam will boil off woods moisture.
Thats just the theory, havent tryed this.

P.s, a candle flame is litle more thain superheated steam, but we all know it can remove moisture no problem.

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Kristijan, I agree. If you can set things up so the exhaust never drops below 212F/100C… you would never condense moisture onto the wood and above 212F/100C there is no limit to the water that can be extracted from the wood. Steam doesn’t care about relative humidity.

A small batch heater might do such a thing as the dwell time short and the gas would stay hot. You would need to swap the batches periodically to keep a system processing wood. I like that idea for sure. It is a another viable route. I think people that tried exhaust heating/drying allowed the exhaust gas to cool too much while in contact with the wood. Happy to hear a comment for those that tried.

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Matt, I totally get the thought. You’ve see first hand how water flashing to steam or condensing can monkey with pressure and change/ruin gas flow through a gasifier.

This system would be outside a gasifier at least for pressure purposes and run all at atmospheric pressure. The hot dry gas at the exit runs into a “just before gasifier” fuel hopper so not connected in terms of pressure. Potentially the gasifier would have a “sluice gate” style refueling flapper so that fuel could be introduced without disrupting the pressure balance. Again… stretch goals…

You could also just dry and slightly torrefy a big batch of wood in one go. Store it for later use. If the outside torrefied (polymerized) it would resist future moisture and should stay dry for years?

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Yeah I know Im just making note of it.

I can tell you though in the furniture industry high temp stean is used to release moisture locked inside the wood. There is something called case hardening where the moisture can be sealed in the core of the wood. Steam opens the wood up to allow to release.

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I don’t know if I misunderstood you but, a monerator is uninsulated and not heated.
The Swedes made a unit that gave these values ​​for the dehumidification of the wood, I think this was pretty good.

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Fair point Jan. I think the monerator mostly does condensing. The heat comes from the gasifier.

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So, I don’t see the need to dry the exhaust if we keep the temperature up. How about running an exhaust pipe inside of, and along on the floor of the wood drying chamber. When the wood and its surrounding chamber exceeds boiling temperature divert the exhaust directly onto the wood. The mass of the wood and chamber needs to be limited by the amount of exhaust heat available to sustain torrefaction temperature (200c to 300c).

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From what I understand, the Swedish unit removes almost all the water from the wood?
If you are going to heat the wood with exhaust gases from the engine, won’t you get too much co2 so the hearth will cool down?

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Jan - I think you would dry with exhaust separate from the gasifier in a batch. That dry batch cycles into the gasifier but the volumes and gases are kept separate.

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This should work and keeps things simple. Just have smallish batches that the exhaust nevers drops below 100C, even with a fresh, wet, room temperature charge.

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I’m just going to leave this here.

“Biomass can contain more than 50% moisture (wet basis) when it is cut; it is generally desirable to dry biomass containing more than 25% moisture (wet basis) before gasification. Drying often can be accomplished using waste heat or solar energy. If the temperature of the drying air is too high, the outer surfaces of the chunk will become dry and begin to pyrolyze before the heat can reach the center. For efficient drying, hot air, which if cooled to 60° -80°C would be moisture saturated, is preferred. The moisture slows feedstock drying (as well as slowing surface pyrolysis). Thus more air is required, improving the drying process (Thompson 1981). During operation of a gasifier and engine combination, 1-in. wood chips can be dried from 50% to 5% moisture content, with drying capacity to spare, using a 20-minute residence time with the hot engine exhaust, tempered with 90% recycle of dryer gases.”

From the Handbook of Biomass Downdraft Gasifier Systems, page 19.

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I look at the hopper in three different stages. Lower pyrorization turning wood into charcoal, gases being released. The middle, lots of steam rising up coming out of wood and top zone is wood coming up to temperatures to begin the downward process. The lower is just above the firetube nozzles and fire lobe where temperatures from 900°f / 482.22°C to 300°f / 148.89°C lower zone just 3 inches above the firetube. Lots of steam boiling out of the wood and becoming charcoal here. Above that is the middle zone lots of steam releasing out of wood rising from 300°f to 150°f / 65.56°C temperatures. Top zone 150°f down to 130°f / 48.89°C tempseratures. The lid and upper side are touchable with the hand depending on how full the hopper is. This is a WK hopper with side wall cooling tubes with gases circulating up through the hopper and down the cooling tubes. Lots of hot gas condensation and water forming in the tubes with black tar. These temperatures can vary on how many cooling tubes that are used.
No insulation on the hopper walls, the walls also help with the condensation process when moving down the road.

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Agree. But l wuld do it the other way around. A continuous, counterflow dryer. Exhaust meets the already hot wood at the bottom (where chips are extracted), and travels up trugh the chips picking up water, then exiting the chip bed trugh holes on the side and enters the double wall upper part, where the wet but still hot exhaust can preheat the rawest chips coming in from the top.

Jan, the monorator extracts all water, yes, but at what cost? Unlike other methods, the energy powering a monorator isnt free, exessive. Its heat being taken from the gasifier hearth, heat that wuld otherwise be used to make more potent woodgas.

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I think it depends on the gasifier that you are using. With a gasifier that has a very high turn down ratio like a WK Gasifier, using the exhaust to preheat intake air. I feel with the grate temperatures at 1500°f / 815.56°C to1700°f / 926.67°C when making good gases there is plenty of extra heat to move up into the hopper to do everything needed to the wood. Now with other smaller firetube gasifiers then yes this would work for more heat in the hopper area.
With a WK Gasifier you are using the exhaust heat still, but in a different way to get more heat into the hopper area.

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Chris,
Thanks for sharing this. I assume the surface pyrolysis problem is even greater for gasifier wood chunks that are much larger than “1-in.” Residence times will stretch to hours instead of minutes.

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Yes, but I was surprised when I read the test that Professor Kyrklund did, I thought it would make more difference.
If I’m not reading it wrong, it made about 10-15% difference between 8.6 and 19.5 and about 20-25% between 19.5 and 47% moisture on the wood, I thought it would be more, but at the same time I have measured 35% on my wood and didn’t notice much.
One more thing when I talk to you, how much surface area is actually needed to heat incoming air from 0 degrees to 100 degrees?
For example, my engine requires about 2000 liters per minute at 2500-3000 rpm, should be quite large surfaces if this amount is to be heated?

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