So be it. My topic. My choice.
And I chose not to debate you.
Spring is now almost here.
Got to go out and cut firewood to be ricked up into drying rows June thru August with my now 15 year old MS440 still on its original engine.
That’s 15 years at 80-100 hours usage per year.
The same year bought MS260Pro with about the same 1000-1500 hours.
Second carbs on both. Those diapahrms do not last forever when on orange bottle oil mix.
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The 440s I think were before the ethanol and emission requirements and largely based on the 044s but cheapened/lightened with abs and more magnesium.In fact, I think they are the last of the ‘good saws’ and fairly sought after.
After that, as near as I can tell, they chose to lobby instead of engineer which is what VW and Stelantis were doing as well. So it must be a fairly common practice in the EU.
I wasn’t trying to debate. I was just trying to point out the gap has closed quite a bit.
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First, i hope i don’t invade your topic SteveU?
It felt right to post this here, because this was just what i had: fun with a small ic engine.
So, JO gave a old chainsaw, so today i did the basic carb work to make it run.
This may help someone, Tillotson hs series is a very common carburetor, and many others is just like it.
First you clean and disassemble your carburetor, diaphragms are often stiff and needs replacement, save the old ones, someone may come up with a method to get them soft again (yeah, right)
Get of all gasket left. The little lever is the fuel metering valve, the tongue should be flush with carb chamber (on 75% of all hs models)
It is easily adjusted by bending.
When taking away the old diaphragm it often bends the tongue out.
Clean this surface carefully, it should be smooth.
The bigger hole close to camera should have a small screen in it, often missing.
If you clean the carb with compressed air, this screen will take of with the speed of light, and end up in the darkest corner under the workbench, or under the dog.
Keep the tip of your thumb over it when blow-clean.
If your parts supplier says they are not available, they lie! The screens is still available.
Buy three, you are going to loose atleast two of them.
Pressed in place, a ,22lr casing is a good tool to push the screen in place.
Before you put in the screen, test the needle valve, shoot brake-cleaner in the hole, put the spray nozzle tight in, no brake-cleaner should pass the needle valve, repeat, and slightly touch the “tongue”, now it should spray right through.
Find some new diaphragms on your tidy workbench.
This is for the pump-side of the carb, the gasket is a used one, it will do.
This is for the metering side, if the lever tongue has a slot in the end, the diaphragm should have a “knob” with a notch.
First gasket, then diaphragm, the notch must slide in the slot correctly, if not, your saw will flood.
Metering lid, the small breather hole must be clean, if not, it will “starve”.
Metering side done.
Pump side, here it is diaphragm first, positioning is VERY important.
Pump lid is best cleaned with a soft wire brush, observe the thin compression ridge for the gasket.
Keep everything super clean, don’t drop any parts on your dirty floor, stupid.
When cleaning a flocked air filter, be careful with the compressed air.
And only blow from the inside.
And we have a runner, on second pull actually
In this little description i left out cleaning of the jets and needles, also left out cleaning under the quelch plugs, this is because this carb was in good shape., a quick and easy tune-up.
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Thanks Goren.
Great picture set.
Knowlegable advices from a guy who had done all of the mistakes and learned better.
I greatly appreciate this.
Regards
Steve unruh
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I had to smile reading your captions Goran. You are a funny guy!
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I make no claims to be a real logger such as this guy.
There are loggers such as him. Expand out and read his written comment description what he uses and why.
Then there are Arborist’s who are a whole different type of guy. Working in Urban locations with Urban’s concerns.
And then firewood cutters. “Woodcutters”. That’d be me. And many here.
The serious use Pro grade of tools matching their needs. The only things that will keep them producing day after day. Year after year. And safe.
S.U.
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Hello.
I finally found a realistic testing of four of the newly available 2-stroke canned fuels. Kind’ long. Watching his early actual release world woodcutting you will see one of the reasons why he is using such a big saw in his Stihl MS661. He is full 32" bar blocks cutting using a 404 ripper chain. Needs the raw power for that.
Then the fact of just how easy it is to accesss on-off the cylinder jugs on the MS 440’s, MS460’s and MS661 saws. The MS 661 the only one still held over in current production to where he could get the extra new cylinder jugs and pistons. Richard Flagg was open internet asking for anyone with spare jugs and piston for his MS460’s he trade near anything for.
Thier after work-run testing commentary beginning at 16:35 has lots of good information and thier experienced opinions in it.
My opinion is I have zero interest in any of the canned fuels due to costs. And I do not want to feed the ECO-beasts I war now with here especially.
But . . . if, when; I find some, some day for free I’lll know OK to at least use these four brands.
Steve Unruh
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Hi SteveU, im with you on the canned fuel, it’s only cost effective in some cases:
A company that works with lawn care and like, where the workers may miss iq/interest in blending a sufficient fuel mix by themselves.
A homeowner that uses his string trimmer/chainsaw only 1-2 hour a year.
A idiot that owns way to much chainsaws to be able to run them periodically.
Season equipment thats stored away half the year really benefits from running on this fuel, just through the system, before storage.
When put in to work, just fill up with usual mix and run.
This will work if the canned fuel is a true alcylate mix.
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Yes. I could not agree more Goren.
I just could not find a real review of the true LONG TERM storage acylate fuel Aspen 2.
This one with no actual engine running before and after visuals is at least fairly neutral discussing costs comparisons of one “Engineered Fuel” to another:
I throw out all of the open air testing of fuels as not at all simulating true in storage tanks or especially in-engine actual loaded running conditions valid.
I am trying to be more than just little bit careful with my 2-stroke oils and now canned fuel put-ups on this topic as these have become very, very Political here in the U.S. now.
(I will PM you a link already put-up on this topic that proves this)
We are now here entering a 12 months period of national political season here with the political Extremes now claiming, and already having proven, they will not accept voting results if they do not win-all. Win-all control.
I will still a maintain from doing this for years now that our pump gasoline even with 10% ethanol will store usable for at least 2 years in throughly sealed, temperature swing controlled thick plastic. Vehicles from the mid-90’s with intact vapor recovery systems.
New modern thick plastic gas cans.
I say this because here, and Canada Aspen in only supplied in plastic containers versus metal cans.
So a fifth use for “canned” fuels . . . something to stock ahead able to store and use out to 3-5 years in needful small engine chainsaws. Ever an Ukraine-like situation comes knocking at your door. With cold, cold winters. As expensive to purchase and store then you will be unlikely to gobble it up early, unnecessarily.
Goren what do you think of the technique of running the saw out of fuel mix completely. Then putting a bit of straight 2-stroke oil in the fuel tank and full choke pulling it thru for over winter saw storage?
Regards
Steve unruh
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Hi All for the next 12 months I will be shifting my personal works emphasis to just small electric generators. NOT necessarily wood fuel gas-able.
Both 2-stroke generators and 4-stroke generators.
I am currently project testing two right now. Pictures and details later if an interest.
In the meantime I’ve been viewing some of James Cordons works. Many by-pass his as he puts up longer then typical videos. Here are three in the sequence of simple; more complex; to as dig in deep as you can possibly go on Honda EU2000’s
This last one for the intimidated best maybe to skip forwards first to 45:45 where he is re-assembling, then test running. Helps you to develop the inward chant, “It is just nuts&bolts; then connectors and wiring harness’s; then more nuts&bolts.” (along with vent, vacuum and fuel lines)
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Hi SteveU, first, this gave me an idea, this spring im going to test, start and run some of my chainsaws, i know fairly well how long some of them have been standing without start-up, going to test some “vintage” and more modern ones, both diaphragm carb, and float bowl carb, some have been standing well 5 years, in non-heated shed, i may present the results here in this thread, or maybe a youtube?
Could be interesting, all is aspen fueled, no “cheat” (ether, starting fluid) just choke and pull.
About running empty, and “preserve” with two-stroke oil, i think it’s a good solution, and i’ve heard of others doing it that way, only word of warning is some two-stroke oils may thicken, almost like syrup when standing un-mixed, even some good brands do this, not really a problem, only thing is carb may not be able to pump fuel, and needs a good cleaning (just a flushing)
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As well known as it is that gasoline goes bad after a year or two, I started a Jonsered chainsaw that had been sitting untouched for 35+ years last summer, still with the gasoline in the tank from then, five-six pulls and it ran fine. Never expected it to start. Didn’t dare to run it for long as I had no idea how the two stroke oil was up to the task so I filled up the tank with a 5% mix. Smoked a bit as expected but still ran fine. I haven’t had any experience with gasoline going bad but then again these days I rotate a few five gallon metal jerry cans so it is rarely over six months old.
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Hi Goren,
I have found two equipment dealers who are listed to stock Aspen fuels within 50 miles from me.
A road trip tomorrow to see.
My hope would be one gallon of their 2-stroke for my current generator project. (the wife’s nose is complaining already detecting my running break-in at 40:1). So which will give the least air-smell evidence? The Amsoil Specter when I switch to 80:1 or the Aspen2?
And a five gallon metal container of their for 4-stokes long storage fuel. Because for all needs and desires 4-stroke suitcase inverter generator s are the way to go.
ALL: watch this one:
I did not know so many were virtually all the same working guts. This is good. Very good.
I am now not so sure Yamaha’s 2000 are thier own engine and designs. ???
Honda’s 2000’s are for sure thier own design. Using a larger engine at lower top end speed. My measured 4400RPM maximum versa the under 80cc types at 4800-4900 maximum RPM. To out-rate; and out-produce the competition, I see now why Honda went an even larger engine to make up their new 2200.
And I found that James Cordon is even more fanatically early oil change break-in operator than me:
Watch from 1:07 → 3:51.
As he said; leaving that first ran worn off setting-in wear metals for 5-50 hours following instruction manuals cannot but shorten the engines useable life. “Oil is cheap. Engines are expensive” Scotty Kilmer.
Young man still James Cordon has an interest in making all small engine tools systems working again.
That was once me too. Not anymore. Now I am how to keep the basic lights on in the least costly; least annoying way, with INTERNAL COMBUSTION engines.
Regards
Steve Unruh
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That was good information in the first video. Now I have to go out and look at my WEN. Also interesting that the Westinghouse generators are the same manufacturer. The are always on sale somewhere.
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Just one notice frome me, when i was younger, i did some whole working days in the woods, in summer, sun, hot, air standing still, mosquitos, after those days working with a chainsaw i always had a headache, sometimes like thunder and flashes, sometimes just a nagging headach, made me grumpy and ill-tempered, always blame i don’t drink water enough.
Next summer my “boss” had changed to aspen fuel, and: no headache (mostly), he even told me he experienced the same, and that was his only reason to change over to canned fuel.
Others have told me the same experience.
Not trying to push anything about canned fuels, just sharing experiences.
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Yes I understand.
I did buy a new 2-stroke Chinese-clone of the Yamaha generator. For three reasons.
One being to now try out now different 2-stroke oils with my now age developed brachial reactive problem.
I can no longer even walk down the stores soaps and detergents isles. Wife has a narrow limited selection of soaped detergents to use. Wife has had to get rid of her wall scent plug-ins. Run her ambiance candles past my nose before buying.
Stihl orange bottle oil is out for me for the last 5-6 years now. And they’re not bothersome to me Ultra does clog spark arresters badly. Other common available 2-stroke oils now out for me too.
I did today drive to three of the regional listed Aspen fuels dealers. The first closed recently going out of businness. Retiring. The second a larger decades in business outdoor power equipment dealer had dropped Aspen end of last year. Drove to a third as looped on the waynhome. Also dropped stocking Aspen last year.
Why? Why? Few would buy it as packaged in a plastic jug. All other engineered fuels are steel can packaged. This is a regional cultural thing. A flaming argument point between brothers even.
I drove 130 miles. Canned fuel cannot be parcel shipped, or mailed to an individual. Truck shipped only by special marked registered pallet load. So a dealer-distributor must be able to invest and buy that pallet load. Only worth it to them if they sell off the full pallet load in a season.
I’ll do some phone calling before I drive even farther north tomorrow to listed Aspen dealers. I do still want the one gallon of Aspen2 for wet storage in the 2-stokes. And a five gallon tin of Aspen4 as a long term storage back up.
The good news is I am breathing fine with the Amsoil Scepter synthetic oil at 40:1 and now 80:1 out of the 2-stroke generator. Had done fine with a Royal Purple synthetic oil the last two years.
I’ll try Echo Red-Armor synthetic tomorrow.
Too expensive to do this one gallon at a time in the forestry saws and the brush cutters/sting trimmers. When a problem with particular oil; then having to dump that gallon.
With the 2-stroke generator I can just run it out, distanced away, downwind of me.
Regards
Steve Unruh
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A new now bright sunny almost Spring day and new results.
The Echo Red Armor oil mixed at ~45:1 will be fine for me. So now I have my three known-good’s. It actually has the least smell. And that smell, not at all unpleasant. No wife complaints.
In the background running; loaded down to ~700 watts.
In the foreground is why I will not be buying another 240 VAC capable unit now
This Sears Craftsman unit was family ran up to me as the now third owner since it was new. Gets passed around as it is VERY LOUD.
I was told, “it’s a 3600 watt unit”. I expected an old flat head engined, exhaust stinking loud can’-hardly 3600 watts unit.
This thing is a 2006 unit with a modern OHV, cast iron bore 202cc engine. Has a big oversized dual output split phase generator head. That heavy spinning mass wound coils armature is what gives it the nearly 2X surge capability. It easily starts up; and pumps up to 150 PSI my oil-less air compressor. Inverter units with stationary windings have actually poor surge capability.
This unit is actually very fuel use thrifty for a 3600rpm synchronous.
I got in trouble with the wife hours 3+ hours running out one gallon of gasoline to be able to do a clean drain out oil change. She hate generators noise.
How loud? Can you listen to all 6:13 to this video??
Mine now as a deep well powering back up to the Harbor Freight 9500. Or a loaner to any of my good neighbors also with deep wells.
I already have three inverter generators. None I want to ever loan out.
I do have three adjacent good neighbors . . . so I needed one more loaner unit. Just order this for $303.79 USD
Much better deal than the Harbor Freight/Champion/Firman 1500/1200 little four stroke 3600 RPM units with their up to 25% THD’s. They are $270. up into the high $300. USD price tags now.
Nope Goren I cannot find anyone stocking Aspen fuels reaching out 100 miles in any direction.
Regards
Steve unruh
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Hi Guys.
As I said I am no James Cordon interested in making any age-era IC engine electric generators restored working.
Nope. Nope. For me they must be fuel use efficient so that means an overhead valve engine. They must be durable worth investing my time into. So that means they must have a cast iron cylinder bore.
Yesterday I passes on a once was 1st quality 9hp Briggs&Stratton engined 120/240 Winco/Wards 4000 watt unit at a local true Estate sale. Was about a 1965 era unit. Aluminum block flathead engine. If it had been the earlier cast iron block . . . maybe for the value of that.
And I have a small partially disassembled missing one side case left-behind Yamaha 1000 watt suitcase inverter-generator unit here I’ve never bother with. The smallest Yamaha’s and Honda’s use aluminum bore engines. That bore gets scored and worn from no oil changes; or running missing air filters then the engine is damaged to being a low compression, oil burner. Junk.
Yamaha was actually one of the firsts doing inverter generator units and have alway been excellent quietly. With many parts service available.
Here watch this completion repair video and see.
Pay attention to his words as he explained things he has learned the hard way doing generators repairs now.
Vapor lock!
My third diffnert use of oil mixes run on the 2-stroke Chinese-clone I pictured above vapor locked on me with sound reducing, plywood pieces propped and then out in the 65F full sun for hours. Opps! It is actually touchy sensitive to even hand waving at low electrical loading near its exhaust. Or sucking back in any engine exhaust into the intake stream. Makes it go into hit-or-miss uneven running.
Best to learn as much as possible from others mistakes.
Learn not to one afraid of these inverter generator units. This one, is one of the only inverter failed units I can find. And that due to mouse nests damage. And that in modern units it is more automotive plastics than metals. Automotive type wiring harness’s. And desktop-like computer plug and play.
Steve unruh
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Hey Steve , i managed roughly 1.2 seconds of that Craftsman generator video before i could find the pause button !
Anyway i can talk this past month has been all about diesel generators for me , Last month we had another blackout for a week up here in the hills and i did what i always do and loaned out all my petrol generators ,leaving me with just batteries and a couple of dead diesels , after a painful 2 weeks trying to get the inverter one running i had to put to the side , and the other old engine i was using for swapping parts over runs so good on waste veggie oil i thought well why not so yesterday i started building a old dc powerhead on , i will take a photo later today to show you if i manage to get it all up and running ,i will stick a short video up as well see how many seconds you can manage .
Dave
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Sounds good Dave.
Small engine DC generating gets a bad rap. Low wattage. Low conversion efficiency.
Back in the early 1970’s when I started doing it . . . it was small flathead engines driving the big old iron truck take off brushes types generators.
Then later the big truck take off large frame alternators.
Ussually limited to ~1200-1500 watts; 12VDC or 24VDC.
Now today in the 20-30 years of many brands of automotive dual internal fans alternators 100 amps is an easy minimum 1200 watts. On up to 200 amps 2400 watts units.
I’ll dig out the case half of the one Chinese 2-cycle clone that I pulled from use because it developed a rattle. Tapered shaft crank - sure. A simple flat steel plate accross that case half cavity with an angle iron across as a bracket. A standard pillow block bearing centered, bolted to that.
The original AC armature hacked-cut for its tapered shaft socket. Rough machined to slip through the pillow block and mount a V-belt drive pulley.
Then any modern dual internal fan alternator will be your battery bank charging friend.
I can look out at four vehicles with in my own driveway with these alternators on them. And at least two take-off’s units stashed out in my shop.
Most of these small generator engines will not long take a high side thrust loading. This way handles that. And belt driving gives you the up/down RPM capability to get the alternator in its fat charging and self cooling RPM.
S.U.
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