Properties of a good wood gasifier

Put a value to what you are worth pr hour. Then go make fuel ready to run calculate your worth into that process. A 40 lb bag of pellets cost $4 to $5.5 this is 320,000 BTU pr bag. Thats a lot of energy for 5 bucks.

Char pellets should be around 9600 BTU pr lb. If you have a device to convert those pellets to charcoal and produce a means of primary heat in that process then you have a big win.

Pellet fuel energy density “”" by volume""" <<< key word there. it roughly three times as energy dense as chip fuel. Keep in mind chip fuel is going vary by species. I am comparing to cedar as this is the most common fuel we could get in my local to me area.

The issues with pellet fuel gasification is the combustion gases migrating into the hopper in a traditional down draft gasifier. If shut down the pellets will saturate with moisture and turn to mush. I accidently developed technology that prevents this. Yes this is my technology , it is mine and went through the sacrifices to develop it. It is my technology and Im not giving it away for free. Go spend your life savings, give up your house and develop your own technology. This is mine and I need to protect it. I did not get government hand outs, I dont have thirty employees like a competitor I have, oh no, I self funded 100% and I am the sole engineer here, nothing has ever been outsourced. Ive done what my larger counter part has done single handedly. Enough on that I could go on. However my view on direct raw fuel gasification has drastically changed since my earlier post here. As I have found that not even charcoal can be exempt from tar. Once this was revealed to me I immediately dropped my technology from market with 10 years of development and hundreds of thousands dollars backing it. That was not an easy thing do. Ive also found charcoal being no more difficult to produce than other fuels as the initial processing is much less; its more like creating firewood. Regardless if you burn it to produce charcoal or run a piece of equipment to produce fuels for raw fuel gasification, those processes require energy input. That chipper chunker also uses energy to run. Sure reducing fuel to charcoal is more energy used to create the fuel. So what!! If your time involved is less its worth the trade off and if you are not wasting that heat energy than you are not wasting it. In that scenario you are coming out way ahead.

Charcoal systems are simpler, charcoal runs way more stable, you can scrub this gas clean as NG, with a good water drip the gas is more powerful than direct raw fuel gasification, Plus that water drip is adding back energy for basically free. Just the H2 production from 1 liter of water is 15,000 btu, this is not factoring the Oxygen shift to Carbon = CO. I dont know how exactly to factor that as the charcoal is part of that equation. CHP systems are more viable with charcoal systems as you can get the heat in the charcoaling process for primary heat around the clock. Not the case with direct system generally the engine has to be running for the opportunity to reclaim that heat. Who wants to be running a system around the clock for both heat and Power. Not me, no way.

Im eating a lot of crow on some of these post;; I was very naïve ignorant, a bit arrogant and 100% hard headed. I am glad I have taken the path I had to take to get where I am today. It has not been an easy road getting here, not one bit of it. For 10 years this has been a struggle with hardship, especially the last 5 years in this market. I would not have learned the things I did trying to control and overcome the physics of a raw fuel gasifier plant. I am a pioneer there and am very proud of that. Programming in C logic was the last thing I ever thought I would ever be able to do. I had two choices when I want to tech school. One choice was programing and the other was mechanical engineering. Me? Program? no way that is way over my head!! and off to engineering school I went. I can now write very complex programing and am grateful to those that helped me along in that learning process. I love programing.

What is the properties of a good wood gasifier system? Well if your looking for both heat and power. I would be one that can produce primary heat, that can make fuel for itself and provide clean gas for power generation without fouling the engine. It would run reliably, and be simplistic. It would be viable and practical to use and not a chore to use.

That is my vision now and what I just described is the VersiFire Power Stove. Indeed it does run on pellets, unfortunately the technology that makes this system possible can only run on a fuel like this. Other small dense fuel may work but in my development process we need to use something that is standard. Pellets fit the bill. We also have a pellet mill manufacturer we are working with. They will be our distro in Mexico, while we will become the distributor here in the US for their mills. We already make the M-1 Series and with innovative thinking you can turn just about anything into charcoal to run it. The way I see it, fuel that you can not process for raw fuel gasification is far more wasteful than the charcoaling process.

Those that maybe interested here is a link the VersiFire. I will launch manufacturing on prototypes this March and hope to conclude initial testing by May. June will take reservations for a short production run over the summer. These will be Beta units and we will test this platform in the field for probably a year. We will need investors to achieve all the certs we will need for this device and if all goes well we will be ready for 2023 model year production. :fire:

https://www.thriveoffgrid.net/versifire

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What?Huh? As always you are running about four levels above my pay grade but I do pick up bits and pieces as I go along and always enjoy your obvious enthusiasm for the things you are working on. You are what America was. Focused on quality and innovation. I’m China. Just taking what others have done and pretending I actually did something more than stick some parts together. God, please tell me how we can get back to that place in time where people like you drove an economy. You have every right to profit from your efforts. Me, and a lot of others here are mere dabblers. You are doing your life’s work. I never built someone else’s house for free and always tried to make as much profit as I fairly could. I would expect the same from you. Keep up the good work. I want to talk about some of the charcoal and pellet issues you addressed but I’ll do it in my Huh thread.

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That’s because your one of the good guys Steve, you don’t ramble on, filling up the forum with useless verbage. Good on you. :smile:
Rindert

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Rindert,
Perhaps it’s nice having people like me in the mix, but I enjoy some of the “ramble,” especially from “smarty pants” Steve. Ha! Ha!

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past quote Bobmac and referring quote to Bobmac
Hi Jan, there are a few ways to do it. If your wood is above 18% moisture content I will pore the charcoal on top of my feed bag of wood. Mix it 1/2 bag of wood to 1/4 charcoal. 3/4 of a bag is all I want to lift into the hopper. I have also put wood in the hopper after light it and put charcoal in the center of the wood about the same ratio. Every gasifer is different. Kristijan will probably give you his mix ratio.
Just play with it. My charcoal is popcorn size and larger. I have used the charcoal out of my gasifer after screening the ash out of it. The smaller charcoal will fall right down in between the wood pieces. It also gets rid of the sticky tar.
I should have posted it on your thread soory. I look at this way, the gasifer made all of this good charcoal why throw it away. Just use It for more power it makes Hydrogen when it has moisture in, and it will absorb tar vapors and uses it to make more power. It is a win win.
Bob
small and dry wood chunks and mix with some walnut and hazelnut size charcoal, about third or a half by volume.
This fuel is what Bob calls “rocket fuel”. It is a abuse resistant fuel. Resistant to overdrawing, moist wood, makes good quality gas over a small reaction area and a lot of it! It will make tar free gas even without much of a restriction.

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These days I occasionally dealt with the regulation of the voltage on the generator, I used a three-phase transformer, where I get 28 V with a rectifier at a generator voltage of 3x400V. The regulation is taken care of by the regulator from the car alternator, to which I have to amplify the output with a mosfet transistor


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I don’t hear anyone lately talking about grate shakers anymore. Who still uses them and how often? What about stationary vs on the road gasifiers?

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Hi Don.

I only shake my grate when it needs it. I may go through several hoppers of fuel and will shake it while refueling with a T bar .

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Hi Don, I have one on my Gasifer, but I don’t seem to ever need to use it. Before start ups I check my grate to see how tight it is. Poking a few holes down there to check it through the grate. If it is really tight I have my manual T- handle shaker tube. I have only used this a few times. The poking with the rod before start ups seems to do the trick.
Bob

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Grate shaker??? No grate - no shaker.

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You need a gasifer shaker. Find the roughest bumpy road you can fine and drive over it at high speeds.
Bob

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Hi, Tone!
13.2.2021
It is a good effort to utilize the heat in the outgoing gas from the gasifier to preheat the intake air for energy recycling!

An alternative or complement to this system is to let the hot gases after exiting the hearth go up in the middle of the silo in a full silo-diameter broad “plank” about 1" thick.

The plank has two “legs”, one on each side of the silo “trumpet”, where the wood is narrowed into the hearth.
The legs are joined to the full breath plank a bit over this funnel, so they will not disturb the wood flow down into the funnel and hearth.
In the silo upper end, the gas is taken out by a horizontal tube screwed into the plank-top.

The plank has a top-lid from which it can be cleaned downwards, and the soot will fall down into the low down ash bunker, passing outside the hearth.

At the hearth-height, the outer “skin” is a double mantel for
preheating the primary air, and insulated outward.

This way no heat is lost to the outside, as no part of it is exposed to outside cooling!

The silo can still have condense cooling, either in an outside cooler, or using the silo wall with an internal separation cylinder in a traditional silo condensing fashion.

Heating the wood directly brings more energy recovery, than
preheating the intake primary air.

But both are done…

Max

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Thank you Max, I am also of your opinion, to overheat the wood and thus dry it as much as possible, and I think that the supply air will be preheated enough in the supply pipe, which will be cooled so that it does not deform.

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Efforts have been made to decrease these losses through various designs; e.g., through insulation of the fuel storage to prevent heat radiation from the outside walls of the generator, through leading the hot gas up around the fuel storage between 118
the outer and inner mantles, through preheating the primary air, etc. With the exception of the last method, however, these measures do not appear to be useful. The reaction ability of charcoal is impaired by very high charring temperature and long charring time in the generator, which may be observed, for instance, in up-draft generators. As men-tioned in the preceding section, it may be more advantageous to promote condensation and dehumidification through extreme cooling of the walls of the fuel storage.

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[quote=“gasman, post:98, topic:5240”]
Hi, Tone!
13.2.2021
It is a good effort to utelize the heat in the outgoing gas from the gasifier to preheat the intake air for energy recycling!

Ok , for me a lot is new!

wood ore charcoal gasifier can work without preheat the intake air?

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Yes they can. But preheating air highers efficiancy and aids to whats called the flywheel effecþ. Making constant quality gas when engine demand shifts.

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and oxidation?

nozzles

i think using max 72 bolts

need make hole 4mm in the bolts

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Hi, Haapio!
15.2.2021
Siittä vaan! Suomen Ekoautoilijat r/y ! (just for reference)

It is still more efficient to deliver the exiting gas heat to the wood in the silo. (indirectly of course)
And complementing condensation at the periphery. In a doubble mantel or externally.

This contributes to better drying of the wood; the internally bound water in wood consumes a lot of PROCESS HEAT, which is lost from the gasification and reduction processes.

So, the drier wood we present to the gasification and especially to the reduction process, the more completion the reduction process will reach.

Max

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Hi, Tone!
16.2.2021

Heat up, gas out!

Max

Hi, Haapio!
17.2.2021
Bolts can be used as nozzles, but size and length and count are naturally dependent of the planned hearh-size.

Gasifier planning usually goes “backward” starting from the planned or needed gas consumption.

Do you need a formula for the consumption of a motor at a specific displacement volume (cylinder volume) and rpm?

The practical design varies with the planned use; for example cars, boats, tractors, stationery designs have their own solutions…

Switzerland had charcoal-gas driven surveillant planes…

Max

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