First, for David B., having started this thread…
My solar “system” is the bad, the ugly, the bare bones, the cheapskate version. Years ago, a friend at work was moving out of the area. he knew I was into alternative energy stuff, and had a passive air to air solar panel that he obtained previously owned and never used, big, bulky, heavy, etc. He would sell it to me for $20.00, come and get it. I brought it home. now what? I had just been involved in a huge (for us) project at the TV station to disassemble and remove the 1968 vintage General Electric UHF TV transmitter that had been replaced by a newer model (about 1998). one of the gems I gleaned was a small continuous duty blower, 120 Vac, about 1 Amp draw running. I plumbed that into the solar panel with some clothes dryer vent pipe, leaned it up against the house at a sunward angle, changed one of the basement windows to plexiglass with holes for input and output pipes. presto! solar heating.
Over the years I have improved it, made a frame stand of sorts, let it fall apart, duct taped it together, replaced vent pipe with whatever I can find (now is partially corrugated plastic field drain pipe non-perforated), Added a semi-automatic control. It works for the times when we are using propane for main heating, and the sun is out. The blower motor is in the basement. the supply air comes from the basement. The warmed air dumps back into the basement and finds its way upstairs. Efficient? no. cheap to run? yes, for now, less than $1 per day. Propane is like Golden Majic Stuff, very expensive. Wood heat not really an option in our household for lots of reasons. So this “system” has been giving cheap bonus heating in our ancient farm house in the middle of windy, flat prairie land for a long time. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Off-Grid meaning, to me, my opinion, yours will vary:
If I buy a woodlot somewhere, carve out a small clearing, provide basic shelter, want some electric conveniences and start building something to power those electric loads, whatever they are, that is off-grid.
We are talking about the National Electrical Power Grid, the one that has power plants, and peaking plants, and thousands of miles of transmission lines, and transformers in substations, and local distribution systems,and pumped-storage plants, and wind farms, and if the 60 cycle AC North-American Electrical Power Grid drops to 59 cycles it is a tragedy and everything goes off line to prevent destruction and mayhem? That grid?
Not connected to that in any way. 
Thanks guys…
It was just getting into the weeds for a while. I think all discussion of all the different permutations of the grid and thought on it are completely great. The current house is grid connectted with about a 3rd of the loads routed through a critical loads panel to be run by solar. We have a 3kW array on site but need to move it closer to the new house. Hopefully this fall.
I really dislike that term Sean. “Grid defector” is used as a dog whistle term for those opposed to off grid power. Personally I think the days of a grid that goes to all corners of the continent are numbered if it does not adjust and embrace the change that is happening. If it obstructs and ignores which is its current tactic it seems it could very well collapse.
It isn’t my term. It is a term used by utility companies in their user statistics. It may or may not have some official government definition behind it as required reporting. I have heard it for a very long time. I don’t disagree that it sounds derogatory.
yes it seems to be a utility created term. It came up repeatedly during the negotiations about feed in rates in California. If I was a slightly darker version of myself I would even say its being lobbed around by a lot of paid for astro turf grassroots groups.
I heard it first in the 70s, so I am guessing it was originally a play on the cold war. but it could pre-date that by several decades. There has always been a fight over the grid especially in regards to self-generation.
We having a pissing contest since kindergarten 
. He always wins but mine is
The cells seem to be 48 V. Straight to the Victron. Excited. To be continued
I am anxious to find out what is going on in these pictures you posted
A Weize panel. It blew off it’s mount in a wind storm (blowing 60s) and pulled out it’s wire. A 12volt soldering iron and a little solder and it’s back.
My friend has a Nissan van electric. He has friends in Prague and goes there almost every month. Used to drive in with a diesel car and the first time with his van it took him 18 hours instead of 9. He let a company put an extra battery in. Just when he did that the next week he got a call for a better battery. Now under the plate is a battery from a Porsche Tycan 130 kWh and he doesnt have to stop until Prague. He didnt mention that when we went to CZ last december. We borrowed his card and try to stop the same places as he did, no way. Wet pants and a lot of stress And he kept asking how fast we could charge, he does more then 200 kW. Boys stay boys
So, he has a batt pack 40 kWh laying somewhere. That is what he brought on the pallet.
I found that video a few posts back and showed him, interesting for your pack. Another friend saw the vid and said, special inverter is not neccesary . I will fix some electronics and its ok. Haha, 1+1=3. Last year I bought a pallet used inverters when they where scarce. There goes one more Really excited how this is going to end.
Batt are 12s 44V all lose packs. So maybe it fits with my Victrons. Dont know what about bms, is it in or not. He told me they are from a E-Golf
Anyone have experience with lifepo4 prismatic cells yet? We have their predecessors.
Yes, build a 10 kWh 48 V. Cells from
littokala, BMS Daly.
You can sleep at night with LiFePo4
Has anyone had experience with silicon dioxide / “lead crystal” batteries?
https://azimuthsolar.ca/reviews-resources-research/silicon-dioxide-lead-crystal-batteries/
They promise a lot but I have not seen enough adoption to tell. If you are paying more than twice what you are for a flooded for it you might as well go lithium. If its in the range of an agm then maybe worth it…
Didnt heart if the chrystals, but lead acid? The only way is Li something, prove I am wrong please.
It depends on what you want to do. At this point if you are off grid lithium is the clear favorite despite the heating requirements and higher upfront cost. I’m doing a lot of grid interactive systems though and for that lithium is not necessary as 99 percent of the time the batteries are just sitting idle or cycling at a 5-10 percent range.
I haven’t heard anything about them in years. I thought they were dead. But low and behold, there are videos on YouTube that tell you how to convert your Lead Acid batteries into lead crystal batteries. (as an aside silicon dioxide is actually found in silica gel desiccant packets)
They originally didn’t have the ability to use as a starter battery. So they must not discharge fast enough. But 6000 cycles seems neat.
When I spec’d out lead acid the major problem was max discharge power and high start current loads. Lithium doesn’t have that problem.
LiFePO4 is a great chemistry for off grid and with prices having come down… I’d be reluctant to experiment with novel products.
A big battery is still big bucks but it is an investment. Five/ten years ago off-grid came with major compromises in lifestyle or expensive investment in ultra high efficiency appliances. The batteries just weren’t there. Now it is possible to have an on-grid lifestyle with on grid appliances (mostly) while off grid.
Will Prowse showed a nice battery. Nice channel. Most of the time sponsered and therefore not interesting but this one was.
The mistaken approach most make in my opinion is folks do not from the get-go have a Balanced approach to home DIY power.
Go ALL, only PV as your production and then you will have to have a very large expensive battery bank to balance out the only 6-10 hours daily of power input. Then some seasonal days only 4 hours. Always a few weeks a year of virtually nothing.
HAVE to then additionally invest in the much more expensive super low energy appliances, and lighting.
Now get real from the get-go and accept you WILL need annually some engine produced electrical generation input . . .
Then use that as a daily in the morning, and the evening; a few hours bulk electrical power making and then the appliances can be modern and normal affordable. Use schedualing in these times of bulk generation periods.
Then a PV system can be smaller, more affordable. As a lighter loads use times carry through; and battery bank topper.
A battery bank can then be smaller, with common tech, as just a quiet, nearly silent nighttime carry over. Very important to have flip switch safe electrical lighting on demand getting up in the middle of the night. The ability to flush a toilet and have it auto refill for next use. Delivered flowing faucet water to wash those post toilet use hands.
Curtis Stone more or less does this balanced approach in his evolving off-grid set up. Not much of a battery bank at all. Bigger on the daily input PV system. And all balanced out by his diesel electric generator set.
He take a lot of crap for that Dino-fuel component. His reasoning is that he must diesel supply annually for his track-hoe and other ground modifying equipments to keep improving his mountain top property.
He could have gone propane generator instead - been my choice when the wife was trying to get me to buy in to a 6 miles up ointo the mountains true off grid place to settle into. And it only had a propane generator. Used 20 pound propane bottles for interior rooms lighting too. Eeek!! No PV. No battery bank at all. Not a safe, costs effective balanced approach at all.
Use propane and the Idealists will still pitch you crap.
It is not all that impractical to even to use gasoline Inverter-generator units. They give the best pathway to later going over to being wood fuel powered. You did get home to there; travel-in-and-out in gasoline fueled vehicles anyhow. I only keep on hand at most two five gallon cans of gasoline. But do keep in vehicles at any one time another 50 gallons stored in their hermetically sealed, vapor controlled tanks. Lasts still good for use for years when in late 80’s and later vehicles with vapor recovery emissions systems.
Screw Idealists and Dreams Chasers. They suck, and waste their life-times.
Do not buy-in and let them waste your time too.
Steve Unruh