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Got up at 5 am the other day and we were having a power outage. Power was back on by 7 but even though I built a fire in the stove, it doesnât heat the house without the fan and pumps. Could get by without the pumps but not the fan. Still sitting on our stimulus check. Iâm going to buy two or three golf cart batteries and one of these charge controllers and inverters. Right now I only care about cheap and quick. This is strictly for emergency power to run the stove and fridge. Iâd like some opinions on these components.
Iâm looking at one of these charge controllers.
This is one Matt suggested when I was looking at this back in the fall.
I was also looking at this. based on some top 9 reviews
Donât really need a 2000 W inverter for this but seemed like a good size for what I may use it for later. This is modified sine wave but I canât see that I need pure sine wave for the applications I intend.
This is a pure since wave for about 80 more dollars but not rave reviews.
Not looking to be an off-gridder with this stuff. More like an RVer. Suggestions requested.
I might consider the stuff reviewed in this video and could afford it but coming out of China with a two month wait will not work for me. Might pull the pin on it in the spring though.
By stove, do you mean a heating stove with a blower fan? If you are going to run anything with a motor, a true sinewave inverter might be better than a modified squarewave.
For any system that runs on batteries, you should make a list of how much power all your appliances draw, and how long you want to run them. Most inverters have enough surge rating to handle inrush current spikes, so unless you are trying to run a really big motor, you can sort of ignore that. It might be a consideration though for a well pump, if you need to run that.
An ordinary upright fridge can use over a kwh per day, and since lead acids should only be drawn down 50%, you might end up needing a fairly big bank if you want a decent backup time. Honestly, for infrequent use, you might be better served with a little generator. It will give you a good testing platform for your charcoal gasifier, too.
How much airflow do you need? I was thinking a blower fan from a car and run it directly on the batteries. That would leave the refrigerator but you need a long power outages for that to become an issue if you leave it closed.
All my power production is grid tied and I can not use it if grid goes down . I left a cord out to connect my diesel generator . I had an uninterruptible 2Kw power supply but left the batteries to dry out and do not want to spend money on new batteries , AND I have a ton of batteries that are only connected to a grid tied inverter , I got the installer to leave before he could connect it to something that I could use . I had a 12 volt system everyone has a 12 volt system . I recommend a 12 volt to 110 volt ac system . Not enough to power every thing hopefully enough .
The fan is just a box fan. I think it draws 130 watts. There are two pumps 80 watts a piece. Donât really need them on emergency power Same with the fridge. Iâm talking about my wood stove. Donât seem to be able to post a picture right now, but the heater box is made from 8 inch channel all welded together with the flanges turned out and those are boxed in as well. The fan in behind a plenum behind the heater and blows air through those channels. Puts out a lot of heat. I have a 2000 watt inverter generator for emergencies but I donât want to have to try and get outside to get that set up in the middle of the night like the last outage. Just want to mainly run that fan for a couple hours if necessary but also buy stuff that I could use if I wanted to do more with it. I guess I could gamble on the pure since wave inverter I linked. The 1000 watt one is only a hundred bucks. Plenty of power for what I really need. Thanks.
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Hi Tom , i play a lot with cheap ways of making and keeping stand by power to hand and if what you are saying your needs are to mainly keep a fan going on your wood fire and fridge then i would forget the 100 AH battery charger and go along this route for your needs as you stated
1 Pure sine wave inverter 1000 or a 2000/ watt one @ 12 volts will do for fans or fridge , no need to go over the top buying quality made one when the cheapo one at a fraction of the price will work and last a good few years , I have several very very cheap Chinese made sine wave inverters that i use for tv , computers and recliner chairs at night time no problems at all over 5 years on the same one and its in the outdoor gazebo under cover from direct rain yet still working great .
if your just going to be needing power for that 180 watt fan then just buy a couple of cheap 12 volt deepcycle batteries and a 10 / 20 amp battery charger with a power meter built in and left on absorption charge or if what i mentioned is too cheap then buy a small 2 or 3 KW inverter charger with a ups and a set of deep cycle batteries to match and that will at least keep you powered up automatically when the power goes off .
If you look on ebay or if you prefer Amazon and look for sellers that are based in the USA with stock in warehouse already to ship out then you might get it a lot faster .
Dave
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Tom , I just realized the cheapo small inverters i bought was nearly 6 years ago i paid $110 each for a couple of them and apart from days when the ambient temp goes over 35c if i pull near max load while i run the air chillers as well it will run the internal fan to try and cool itself down and if its still too hot will just close down till it cools and then restarts ,this is what it looks like after all those years sat in the open ,look how rusty the fan cover is now as well
Another thought would be to look on your second hand papers or internet sites and buy a used UPS , they will probably need new batterys but again they are cheap to buy and simple to install with built in charger and power switch over
Dave
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Hi this is me Kevin, i wonder if any of the off grid folk here at DOW had any thoughts on buying edison batterys OR NIFE/ NICKEL IRON BATTERYS. Or had any experiance useing them,and or pros or cons, and or recomend a known good location for perchase from.Thanks.
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Iâll check that out Dave. My off-grid power expectations are very low right now. My discussions on the site here have pretty much burst my balloon as far as running my Greenhouse full time off-grid. I just donât want to have to get up in the middle of winter and have to go out side to get a generator running to get heat in the wee hours. Right now all this has to do is run that fan for a few hours. Anything else would be a plus. I have enough cash to get a couple golf cart batteries, the charger and inverter. I will get the higher amp charge controller just because I can afford it and it would give me some flexibility if I wanted to go bigger. Thanks for the advise.
I looked into this in great detail a couple years back the cost is just too high in North America. If you have an import export business you could import them from china directly at less than half the price I tried to go down that path as a private citizen but by the time I got a quote and the shipping details the risk of identity theft seemed way too high to me I needed to provide my social security number to the shipper importer and the company in China for tax purposes. An import business can do this with the federal tax ID but your SS is your tax ID as a citizen.
What closed the door on them for me was the fact that even at the direct importing cost it was cheaper today to buy two sets of the modern AMG batteries that are rated for 12 years. Plus the modern Edison batteries are not designed to be serviced so when they fail you canât simply take them apart with a wrench and scrub the plates clean you have to actually cut the plastic case open.
So if you could stumble across an old set at a railroad station where they where used to run the lights on the tracks or something I would jump on them but to import them it just didnât add up to me. And to buy them from the importer in north America that is crazy you can replace them 4 times with 12 year batteries that are mantaince free for less. They wonât budge on the price either I tried. They just told me I didnât understand their costs when I asked why I could have them shipped directly to my door from the factor at less than half their price before shipping is added to their costs. Which was sizable fright charges.
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This worked fan worked made noise , did not work like it was plugged in . Left battery on charger but unplugged charger week ago . Fan is moving photo stopped it
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Yeah, I have looked into NiFe batteries a couple times, but they are not very common, and they are quite expensive. I believe there is only one supplier in the US, and of course all the manufacturing is in China. As far as importing them yourself, Tom, were you figuring in the customs duty and any brokerage fees for having a representative meet the goods at the port of entry? I am going to need to import a part for my electric truck from Canada, and reading about customs is crazy. Small orders are not so big a deal, and UPS will handle it for you if you ship with them, but I guess if it is coming with freight you need to go down and actually sign for the stuff in person wherever it lands in the US. Costs aside, I do think NiFe is a very smart chemistry, and even the modern ones should last for a really long time. They are not very efficient, they self discharge quite a bit, and you need to water them, but hey, they are basically an antique technology, what do you expect? 
Anyway, I have run a couple of lead acid batteries into the ground before, but I have not used AGM much. The only good things to be said for lead, in my opinion is that they are ubiquitous, cheap up front, and tolerant of abuse. AGM is a little more touchy about being overcharged, if I recall, and all lead acids will degrade if you discharge them more than 50%.
I am starting to think that my next off-grid bank is going to be out of a salvaged EV. You can get a huge amount of storage that is designed for really heavy loads - so running them in a low-power stationary application should really boost their lifespan. Also, as more and more EVs are on the road, the prices keep coming down. I bought Tesla-made lithium modules for 130$ per kwh - which is basically cheaper than name brand flooded lead acids. Lithium batteries do need a BMS, but they really are amazing batteries. Anyway, just my 2 cents.
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I had an original Edison railroad battery service manual . Part of maintenance of battery is replacing electrolyte . The battery gave decades of service , was not an efficient battery and required maintenance . A salvaged EV battery on warranty would be much better . I gave the Edison manual to a scientist developing a redox flow battery . I think these type batteries will be best for large storage . I never heard from the guy again . If I still had the manual I would have posted charts from it to answer some questions .
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Yep, thatâs pretty much all Iâm really looking for at this time Henry. We have had two very short outages in the last three months. They are very rare now since the power company came and ran new wires. Probably someone ran into a pole.
The thing about those Edison Batteries is that someone was making them back in the 1890âs or earlier out of commonly available materials. Canât see why someone could not DIY them now. Maybe if I sell my mud truck this spring Iâll think about investing in a real off-grid set up. What are you using your off-grid set up for Carl?
The nickle is too expensive is the issue with making Edison batteries now.
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My total experience with Nickle is welding rod. We used to use it for welding the mold line rails in the foundries. Had to turn in our stubs to prove we werenât wasting it. Iâve welded cracked cast iron engine blocks with it as well.
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I have run large banks of both Changhong NiFe and rebuilt Edison NiCd cells for the last 8 years or so.
Nickel cells are not for the faint of heart. From the initial cost, efficiency, or maintenance perspectives.
That being said,
If you think that you will need the ability to store energy in the longer term without support from regular infrastructure such as commerce, transportation, communications, security ⌠then ⌠Nickel cells are a good fit.
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I think a lot of us have gone down the NiFe rabbit hole. The round trip efficiency of NiFe cells is terrible. So on top of the inflated battercost you need to gross up your energy production to offset the inefficiency. Do your own research - I wonât tell you not to - but for me NiFe is a dead end. I think what most people find attractive about NiFe is the long life, DIYâability (maybe) and serviceability from first principals. But practically speaking, almost anyone is better off with something else.
I think turns a lot of us off with batteries is the limited cycle life. I want a âforever batteryâ. If that is the issue I would look at Lithium Titanate chemistry. Those cells have huge cycle lives and while the cost is higher than some other chemistries in terms of $/kwhr, itâs too bad. Some very large amp-hour cells are available which makes pack construction a bit easier.
If thatâs not your speed⌠regular lead-acid cells are not that hard to service or even recycle. If end times come, I doubt a 2% risk of lead poisoning is going rank very high among your survival worries. Lead melts at low temperatures and is easy to cast into new plates. Electro-chemistry to remove sulphates and other contaminates isnât that tricky. If you think you can refresh NiFe batteries you can probably do lead acid too.
Personally I think the cheapest lithium cells you can source are your best bet right now. By the time they wear out something much better and cheaper will be available. the production growth in that sector is insane. The same argument would work for lead acid but their max current is limited vs lithium, so limited that they can be impractical for many uses.
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It is my only source of electricity, so, everything 
I have a yurt on an 80 acre property, and it is about half a mile to the nearest utility pole. At the moment I have 1.5kw of solar panels, a 75-100watt hydro turbine that runs during the winter months (and is a real pain in my ass because the intake keeps clogging). That feeds 2 LifePo4 battery packs that I got last spring. They are rated at 3.8kwh each, but I dont fill them all the way up to try and extend their life, due to the fact that I often have more power than I need when the hydro is going.
I am running a 1/2 horse well pump, a front load washer, a tiny DC freezer, a converted chest-freezer-turned-fridge, lights, laptops, a cell booster, and miscellaneous electronics. In the summer I even have a little window AC unit that I can run for a few hours. Hot water is on-demand propane, and we cook on a woodstove or a propane burner.
I have a backup generator, and I rarely use it. Only when the hydro goes down for several days, and the diapers pile up do I have to resort to that. It is of course a constant dance, but I kind of like it. If the outside world went dark tomorrow, I would have about 6 months before my propane runs out and I have to start figuring out where my next hot shower is coming from. (although I would probably have starved to death by then anyway, so its sort of a moot point)
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